Marriage, Mortgage, Kids…f~~~ that s~~~

[33wolfmanParticipant 216]

Doc, you and Robert should get together and write a book, but then again those who have been around females enough could see the situation playing out like you said. Vector, a few tips and hints, (1) Do not engage in conversation with her, one word answers or the bare minimum, you can be civil but keep it short. (2) If you have your own room put a deadbolt on the door and give NO ONE the key, if your parents make a fuss say it’s your room and if they want to get in it wait till your home. (3) You need to put yourself on war time footing, the witch and your mom have everything planned out, moves and counter moves, and THEY made the battlefield YOUR home, so they are confident. Stay away from the witch as much as possible, freeze them out, throw up the battlements and let neither approach.

[sidecarParticipant 35837]

Vector wrote:

If I leave, and she stays, doesn’t that mean that “she won?”

Who cares? This isn’t about “winning”. It’s about NOT LOSING, and you are being set up to lose.

She may not want to get you back, but I can guarantee she wants to get back at you. Whether it’s your time, money, life, or whatever, she thinks you owe her, and she will stop at nothing to get her pound of flesh. And your mother is helping her do it to you. Your mother probably thinks you are robbing her of the daughter-in-law and grandchildren she was counting on, so she thinks you owe her as well. Or her feminism is overruling any maternal feelings she might ever have had for your well being. That alone should be sending you out of the house to your own place immediately, if only to get away from your own backstabbing mother.

Seriously, find your own place and move the f~~~ out immediately. Even if it’s only temporary. Don’t let anything, not their arguments, not your finances, not your ego, not a sense of “winning”, NOTHING keep you from moving out because you are living in a f~~~ing snake pit right now, and it’s only a matter of time until you are bit.

[harpo-my-“SON”Participant 2410]

Move out and shame her about being a parasite at your parents house. I went to work and came back to this topic three pages long now and its not playing out as I expected. Such a triumphant  first post made everyone at the forum happy to see a man get free from an obvious trap…Now Its a month later and she still has a way to work on you, and with your mothers blessing no less..I am sorry but can’t hide my disappointment. She has no motivation to leave as long as your there. Even if she does leave you have no say whether she can come back or not. I can’t be optimistic about you avoiding the one sloppy blowjob that would add so much more trouble to this almost break-up..This near miss evacuation. I will hold out some bit of hope. Everyone here at the forum must share at least a little of the disappointment I feel, about you not having made a complete and total get-away. You had a full month at starting your journey going your own way and this is how far from her you are. With her telling you    “oh well, too bad.” when you express your desire for her to leave. GO MY FRIEND GO

I was bound to be misunderstood, and I laugh at those who misunderstand me. Kind mockery at the well intentioned, but unfettered cruelty towards those would be prison guards of my creative possibilities. This so as to learn as much from misunderstanding as from understanding. Taking pleasure in worthy opponents and making language fluid and flowing like a river yet pointed and precise as a dagger. Contradicts the socialistic purpose of language and makes for a wonderful linguistic dance, A verbal martial art with constant parries that hone the weapon that is the two edged sword of my mouth.

[experiencedParticipant]

Consider seriously moving somewhere distant enough that SHE can’t find out how long you’ve signed a lease for.  Give her and your mom enough rope to hang themselves with timewise. I’m gonna guess three months for starters. Then for the love of NOT f~~~ing this up, do not call like a trained lab animal at twenty nine days 23 hours 59 minutes, OR they will KNOW that they’ve got you by the b~~~~ and everything before then is squandered. It’s like tennis, you can not control what they do when the ball is on their side of the net. Thinking outta the box here, your mom might adopt her, who knows? but if that does seem plausible, what kind of life would you have had there.  Also, my immediate reaction to she’s taking a vacation is MOVE HER STUFF THE EFF OUT – but maybe that’s not thought out. But, possesion is 90% of ownership, so when she’s on vacation pay your dad to take mums to the restaurant and when they’re gone, have preappointed movers move her s~~~, to storage in Hoboken.

"It seems like there's times a body gets struck down so low, there ain't a power on earth that can ever bring him up again. Seems like something inside dies so he don't even want to get up again. But he does."

[harpo-my-“SON”Participant 2410]

Personally I would have rather been in a tent at a KOA campground than under the same roof with someone like that..KOAs have internet now, and I have pitched a tent at a few when working out of town.

I was bound to be misunderstood, and I laugh at those who misunderstand me. Kind mockery at the well intentioned, but unfettered cruelty towards those would be prison guards of my creative possibilities. This so as to learn as much from misunderstanding as from understanding. Taking pleasure in worthy opponents and making language fluid and flowing like a river yet pointed and precise as a dagger. Contradicts the socialistic purpose of language and makes for a wonderful linguistic dance, A verbal martial art with constant parries that hone the weapon that is the two edged sword of my mouth.

[BrainPilotParticipant 7640]

If you leave and she is still there at your parent’s house, she did not win. This is a contest between you and your fiancé. (I am going to continue to call her by that word until you achieve an escape from her stated intent to rule you). The contest is not a contest over who has the longest squatter’s rights in your parent’s house. It’s a contest for your future. By that, I mean your assets, future earnings, self respect, independence etc. Basically, this is a contest over wether or not your fiancé (with your mother’s cooperation and assistance) is going to succeed in turning your future into your father’s present.

The life your father has now, and has had for many years, is the intended plan for you. Your fiancé has not given up that plan for you. If she had, she could have organized a move out in the time it’s taking her to plan a vacation. She is not going to give up that plan for you until she finds another man to target with it. They don’t let go of one branch until they have a grip on the next one. Moving out would mean letting go of you, and she hasn’t done that.

While I’ll acknowledge the very likely possibility that the ‘vacation’ is just a trip to visit some old ex that is still orbiting so she can assure herself of the grip she has on him before letting go of you, I am not presently trying to save that poor bastard. I am presently trying to illuminate the situation for you.

What exactly do you think she meant when you made the same point I did about planning a move with the time she’s using to plan the vacation…and she answered:

She said “oh I got everything in check I don’t need you to tell me that.  I’m way more prepared and ready then you think.”

I can’t know for certain what she meant by that, but if you stay in that house with her and your mother, you are very likely going to find out.

The faster you get out of the house, the faster she will grab on to the next branch. As long as you are in the house with her, I don’t see any reason for her to let go of her plan for you.

Look, it's not my fault that tornado dropped a house on your sister. Now get back on your broom and get your ass out of here... and take your monkeys with you

[harpo-my-“SON”Participant 2410]

BrainPilot  I agree A woman never gives up until its obvious to her that the man has moved on, and he has moved only enough to make himself a  more challenging target. She will not take much longer to get his dick in her mouth if he stays in range. He is still engaged in her mind…

I was bound to be misunderstood, and I laugh at those who misunderstand me. Kind mockery at the well intentioned, but unfettered cruelty towards those would be prison guards of my creative possibilities. This so as to learn as much from misunderstanding as from understanding. Taking pleasure in worthy opponents and making language fluid and flowing like a river yet pointed and precise as a dagger. Contradicts the socialistic purpose of language and makes for a wonderful linguistic dance, A verbal martial art with constant parries that hone the weapon that is the two edged sword of my mouth.

[experiencedParticipant]

@brainpilot. Thank you for the hard work that got you to your current station in life, and even more for the help you give men here. After every post written by you, it’s the same reaction, “Man, that guy can think.”  At the risk of being rude, would you please bring up this site in conversations with peers who’ve shown evidence of the right attitude.  It’s war, the site with the most Cray computers…

"It seems like there's times a body gets struck down so low, there ain't a power on earth that can ever bring him up again. Seems like something inside dies so he don't even want to get up again. But he does."

[GrotesqueRogueParticipant 116]

Man, you should just run away.

So many people already told you that, and they did it because they want to help you.

And the current situation does look like a set-up. No one doubts your manlyhood and stuff and the fact that you are capable of handling your issues on your own. But it’s time to listen to what we all say.

Otherwise, you might as well become a prime example of how one person almost voluntarily ruined his life while having plenty of chances to save himself.

[Robert HallamParticipant 696]

Hey Vector:

One last post on this from me. You don’t seem to realize just how much market value you have as a 30 year old male. She does. You should be using it to the absolute maximum benefit. Once she has you tied to a marriage licence she gets everything from then on in. And I mean everything. She can’t loose. Get out, Get out. Find somewhere else. Use your imagination. Don’t you have a sleeping bag? Doesn’t hurt to live out of your car for a few days. When you are not there, it will drive her nuts. If you are not there she can’t work on you. She can’t arrange to have you accidentally on purpose see her get out of the shower naked. See her run into the bedroom with just her panties on. Get out of your apartment every night, and don’t come home until at least the very early hours of the next day, just in time to leave for work. Don’t give her any time to button hole you into a heart to heart conversation. Sorry I gotta go. No time; no time. If you have a problem talk to my mom or dad. See you some other time.

This is my last post, but keep us updated.

[Anonymous 42]

[Lazarus LongParticipant 365]

Vector I wanted to post this and I sincerely hope that you will not take anything here as intending to run you down, this is all to try and illuminate things for you. Admittedly I cannot say anything that someone else here has not already said i am hopeful that if you hear it enough and in whatever happens to be the right way for you that you will get the message.

Firstly I do want to congratulate you on your first realization and taking the first red pill, unfortunately this is a road of many awakenings and you are still new to this from your recent posts. Again this is not intended to belittle you but to remind you that there is a world of truth out there and it can be hard to see it especially when you would like nothing more than to believe in the opposite.

Maybe you are having a hard time seeing the big picture here so I am going to try and distill this thread and the information you have provided into a timeline. First you come to us saying 

Vector wrote:

That night she got really drunk, and blurted out to me in front of her mother, aunt’s and cousins “I’m going to rule you.”  This was a BIG red flag for me….

Well you certainly were right about that. You were then advised to go ahead and do the breakup which you did. 

Since you both are living under your parents roof you were advised to get all of her s~~~ out as soon as possible but you were somewhat resistant to this idea. We (MGTOW commentators) suggested several possible means to do this i.e. Get a storage place and move all of her s~~~ there (You missed this one). You then informed us that her parents were going to come get everything and of course that would have been a fiasco so you were advised to pack everything up and leave it outside for them (You missed this opportunity as well Strike 2) Then she changed her mind about leaving and is scheming with your mother behind your back and you are now living together again in a really s~~~ty arrangement (Strike 3)

I encourage you to go read all of your posts in order and when you do so pretend that you are listening to a person on the internet and this is not you writing what would you tell yourself.

I want to close this by giving you a short story about my mistakes. I was married and had two kids, My then wife had pretty much abandoned us but when she moved out she took the kids with her. Later on she made mistakes that ended up with me having our children (Fortunate for me) as she lived on her own and continued to struggle and leach off of people the anger between us cooled and overtime because we interacted somewhat regularly due to our children she slowly ever so slowly convinced me that she changed. Long story short on that is that I took her back into my home where the game continued until she got another branch to hang on and left again. It was then I finally finalized the divorce.

Please do not live the mistakes I made, you have a choice right now to leave and put this all behind you. Who gives a damn if its a cheap s~~~ty apartment nothing is permanent except death. Use the time to gather resources and make future plans. Just LEAVE you are almost at the point where it will be too easy for you to fail and fall back into the relationship and it will be much worse next time because she was not joking when she told you she was far more prepared than you were. She tipped her hand again do not miss the sign, If you continue as things are she will execute her plan and it will not be good. I pray that you will make it through this well but do not let her have a chance, to steal from KeyMaster If i handed you a box of grenades and asked you to pick one up and pull the pin with the knowledge that not all of them will blow up on you would you still do it?

Anyway sorry for the long post but just think it over. Do NOT talk to her and avoid any contact you can. Remember time is on their side not yours, the sooner you divest yourself from the situation the better you will be.

Willfully turning aside from the truth is treason to one's self. -Terry Goodkind

[Anonymous 42]

(((((((((((((((((((((((((( I’M GOING TO “OWN” YOU! )))))))))))))))))))))))))))

[MgtowWaveParticipant 4352]

Vector????? I hope you listen to us.If not brother im sorry to say it but you will regret it.

frankly my dear i don't give a damn

[VectorParticipant 178]

Guys, I am sure you all will be happy to hear that I have looked for apartments today, and emailed several people off craigslist and made some phone calls for appointments to look at apartments.  After I finish writing this, I will continue to search and contact potential moves.   I will follow through and book as many as I possibly can for this weekend.  I work from 8am to 7pm every night so the weekend is my only time to book apointments.  If I can seal a deal this weekend, I’m out.  It would be pretty funny come Monday and I’m not living here anymore, she wouldn’t know how to handle it.  She would feel so awkward living here with my parents, like a tenant, and would be forced to leave out of being uncomfortable.  I only have this weekend to sign a lease for an apartment, because I have to work all of next weekend, so if not this weekend, then it won’t be until 2 weeks from now, which is the end of the month anyhow.

Again, I appreciate all of your commitments in advising me the best solutions to my problem.  My question is, what is your biggest concern if I don’t leave ASAP?  Are you thinking that I might succumb to her beauty and fall into the marriage trap?  I already stated my belief on marriage.  I’ll never get married, it’s a woman’s way of stealing your b~~~~ forever.  Like I said, there is no way she will ever be able to suck me back into her life and get back into a relationship with her.  There’s far too much damage done, and harsh words exchanged to ever get back with her.  No amount of walking around in sexy panties or anything else sexual for that matter will ever convince me otherwise.

My new found daily red pill knowledge along with the countless of hours listening to Tom Leykis, watching MGTOW videos, and gaining insight from all the wise men on this forum has taken me so far to the other side of the spectrum, that I can’t possibly ever go back to being a blue pill man.  The saying of “once you take the red pill, you can never go back to blue pill thinking” is so true.  I’m like a completely different man now, and so fortunate I found MGTOW in time before sabotaging my freedom for life.

 

[StargazerParticipant 12505]

Good move. And if you can’t find an apartment, just go live in a weekly hotel until the end of the month. Consider it your Declaration of Independence.

The question isn’t “what is she gonna do” but rather what are YOU gonna do. A female has breached your safe space with the help of your traitorous mother and your only recourse is to make a strategic withdrawal. It’s not about what *could* happen if you don’t, but a matter of principle. You control your own destiny, not two females who do not have your best interests in their hearts (sorry, that was redundant).

[Smitty the Great OneParticipant 1535]

Vector my brother, you are in a fine mess; but you can get out. Victory is achieved by her absence, and nothing else. When she’s gone…. however this occurs, you win. Your mom deserves your absence as well, she choose a side and it wasn’t yours. Consider her no better than the c~~~ that tried to rule you. I wish it didn’t have to be this way buddy, but it is. When this is over and she has left your parents house you need to have a “heart to heart” with your mother. Let her know that her behavior in this incident was completely unacceptable. I she wishes to remain a part of your life, it will NEVER HAPPEN AGAIN. You are suppose to love and trust your mother, and she proved she is worthy of neither.

Life is too long to play by someone elses rules....

[experiencedParticipant]

 

Vector, “My question is, what is your biggest concern if I don’t leave ASAP?”

If  you don’t leave ASAP you are, via your actions/lack thereof, ignoring everyone’s attempts to help you. You’d then fully qualify as an askhole. My question is,  are you an askhole?  Personally I enjoy solutions more than drama. Ignore these guys’ heartfelt attempts to help you and you will succeed at getting drama. Some people are downright happiest when they are miserable. This isn’t a f~~~ing negotiation here, it’s your f~~~ing life. I’m outta here, you can lead a horse to water but you can’t make him drink. WAKE THE F~~~ UP VECTOR.

edit, please, no I don’t want notification of follow up to this epic saga trauma drama saga

"It seems like there's times a body gets struck down so low, there ain't a power on earth that can ever bring him up again. Seems like something inside dies so he don't even want to get up again. But he does."

[BrainPilotParticipant 7640]

Vector,
First, I want to high five you, and everyone else in the thread for this. I smell victory…

I don’t taste it or have it in hand yet, but I smell it. It’s close.

Although we can all agree the sooner you get out, the better, right now it sounds like you know this. The only thing I would add here is that when you find a place, and establish a date for your move out, KEEP IT TO YOURSELF UNTIL THE LAST POSSIBLE MINUTE!!!

By that I mean 3 people in the same house at the same time all say in unison, “Wow! There’s a moving truck blocking our driveway… what is that thing doing here?”

The reason for this is that, to answer your question about what the risks are if you don’t get out asap: I can’t guess with any accuracy what sort of estrogen fueled craziness your fiancé might come up with if she is given a deadline for when she will no longer have access to you. There are just too many different versions of crazy that I, as a sane person, cannot anticipate for you. I have seen a lot of crazy from women over the years, but I suspect that as one individual man I have only seen small sample of the total capability.

Maybe she finds something sentimental to you that you intend to take with you on the move out and hides or destroys it… maybe she keys your new car… maybe she picks a fight… maybe she calls the police… maybe she shows up at your job to make a scene and embarrass you, or make an accusation at you to get you fired…

What is predictable are the stages reaction to loss that a woman goes through. They follow a pattern (loosely) that progresses from denial, to bargaining/negotiating, then to anger/rage before finally coming to acceptance. Your fiancé is about to lose her lifetime meal ticket for which she has few options to replace. Getting your mother to let her have continued access to you in your own house is negotiating/bargaining. It is not just accepting and moving on. Before you get to her just accepting the loss, you are going to see anger/rage from her that you have likely not yet seen.

She can continue living in denial and trying to figure out ways to negotiate the situation and somehow lure you back with promises of change, counseling, whatever… as long as she has access to you.

I believe you when you say these things she’s doing are not going to work. But my message to you is that you should already be gone when she comes to believe that they are not going to work, because that’s when the rage and the crazy start. When she realizes that you are gone, and HOPE of you is gone, she will have nothing to lose from going completely bats~~~ nuts on you.

Better for her to keep telling herself that it is weeks or months away, than to EVER know that it is only days or hours away. You have nothing to gain and everything to lose from giving her your move out schedule in advance.

Keep us posted, buddy. Speaking for myself and likely for others here, you are the first person I’ve ever actively made an effort to save from a that whole marriage trap. Most others I’ve thought either had no hope because they were such blue pillers they were beyond help, or needed no help from me because they’d already been burned badly.

I want very much for you to come through this unscathed for my own reasons.

You’re sort of the mgtow mascot now… 🙂

Look, it's not my fault that tornado dropped a house on your sister. Now get back on your broom and get your ass out of here... and take your monkeys with you

[MgtowWaveParticipant 4352]

Vector

Women are manipulative.And when manipulation dosent work vengeful.They learn to  be manipulative at a very young age  http://tweenparenting.about.com/od/behaviordiscipline/a/Social-Aggression.htm

http://tweenparenting.about.com/od/socialdevelopment/g/Frenemy.htm

On top of that women have an in group bias and men dont.Humans simply prefer women over men.

This is why(for these two reasons) the MRA/MHRA has been so unsuccessful.

This is why healthcare for women gets soo much more funding than mens healthcare.

This is why   women get WAY more help for than domestic violence then men,despite domestic violence being about 50% / 50% .

http://web.csulb.edu/~mfiebert/assault.htm

This was known decades ago and was covered up.People like Erin Pizzey who spoke up about it were silenced.

You remember the movie War Games?

Thermonuclear war.

There is no “winning” with a woman like this.As in thermonuclear war the only way to win is not to play.Not to play her game.

The only way to win is to opt out.To go MGTOW.To walk away and cut your losses.

See the video posed upthread about female manipulation(the redhead) Diana Davidson.That woman knows you like the back of her hand by now.All the time she has been seeing you she has been studying you.She knows you family too.She know what to say and who to say it to and how to say it.

These are things that women learn at a very young age.

This is one aspect of female power as it has always been.

Like i said this is why the MRAs like AVFM have been such a failure.And this is why they are soo desperate to vacuum up female supporters.And it has failed on them spectacularly a few times.This is also why or at least part of the reason why they have been distancing themselves from a lot of the MGTOW community.They are trying to gain momentum for their movement. Tey are afraid of being associated with “woman haters”

Now as to your question?How is she going to manipulate you into getting what she wants?Its almost impossible to know what her back up plans are , plan B ,plan C , plan D because all of them would be fluid and changeable depending on circumstances minute by minute .With  thousands of different possible permutations – for example

Could she get pregnant by you?

Could she get pregnant by someone else and say its by you?(happens a lot)

Are you really sure that if she came to you and said im soo sorry baby ill be better baby i promise cross my heart and hope to die -would you relent ?are you sure?

What would or could happen if she came to you in the shower and said i want you to f~~~ me one last time?

Could she call the cops on you and falsely accuse you of domestic violence? (happened to me)anyone else?

From what you told us she is mostly using highschool girl level manipulation but have no doubt that she plotting and planning and consulting with every one she can.

The bottom line answer to you question is i dont know.I dont have a mind like that(manipulative) to give you a definitive answer.

But listen to what these people and women say

http://commons.wikimannia.org/images/Esther-Vilar_The-Manipulated-Man.pdf

MGTOW  is to look at the chessboard and to opt out of playing and peaceably walk away .

But thats not what i did.I didnt know better.I thought i was holding enough cards that i would be ok.That nothing bad would happen to me.i listened to the “Im sorrys” and i allowed myself to be seduced.Also i had empathy for those women i didnt want something to happen to them if i just got up and left without saying anything.They had resources and plans that i could not even imagine.They had a plan B and a plan C and a plan D and a plan E .

Ill tell you that at different times people had warned me .

 

frankly my dear i don't give a damn

[Author]

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