Home › Forums › The Litter Box › I Believe MGTOW to be wrong, or at least, misnamed
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BrainPilot 4 years, 11 months ago.
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Why is is so important for someone to wander in here from time to time in an attempt to polarize MGTOW and give it a cause or direction? I don`t see this place as an echo chamber. Rather I see a bunch of men who share a common paradigm and still have enough common respect for one another to accept the differences from one individual to another. However I don’t personally see a bunch of p~~~ing matches here among the guys trying to convince anyone they are wrong about a particular topic. We are all just doing our own thing and this happens to be a place we gather to compare notes. It just happens that a great deal of our notes have a lot in common. Big deal…we are having a lot of the same experiences at large in the world. Does that make this an echo chamber? Hardly….
Ultimately we don`t need nor do we desire anyone to come in here and tell us we are wrong. F~~~ I’ve been married twice. If I wanted to listen to that speech again I’d find another wife!
HISTORY...learn from it, memorize it, DON'T repeat it....I honestly think its becoming an echo-chamber and a swirling pot of self-perpetuating misery. However, I could be wrong.
Echo-chamber? Possibly. As CP says:
We are a refuge for men some of whom have been seriously abused.
Many of us here tried to play by society’s and women’s new rules and have been chewed up and spit out. Some of us multiple times. So we come here and find like-minded people who share similar experiences and have decided to avoid the grind.
You view it as self-perpetuating misery. For me, it is just the opposite. I am enjoying playing the fiddle while Rome burns instead of running around trying to put out the fires whilst being consumed in the process.
"You don't know a woman till you have met her in divorce court."I think I will explode
Explode where prey tell?? Into some ‘young hot thing’ – sicko!
"I care not what others think of what I do, but I care very much about what I think of what I do! That is character!"
~ Theodore RooseveltSorry again for the length
(something MOST men never apologize for)
"I care not what others think of what I do, but I care very much about what I think of what I do! That is character!"
~ Theodore Roosevelt<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>TheTruth wrote:</div>
How many of you would resist the temptation to blast in a hot young stranger offering it up with a smile and a coo? NOT A DAMN ONE OF YOUI find that extremely repulsive and offensive. Call me prude if you wish – but I wish to stay in my own age bracket thank you! Some of us have daughters at the age you suggest as ‘young’ – sick… really sick. Are you trying to paint us as sex-crazed pedophiles? I repeat – sick, really sick!! I take no offense in being called old-fashioned or prude so swing away (I will swing back)!
Not at all. I’m saying that your mental framework where you ascribe feelings of guilt, to dating women who are (of legal age and) the same age as your daughter is not natural and was given to you for a purpose. A purpose that does not benefit you. Look at how quickly you assumed I was talking about ‘underaged’ women, and how much quicker you made sure *you* weren’t one of them. That can only be a learned reaction sir. Certainly I will grant you that young, beautiful women may not be your thing. If you will grant me that 8/10 straight guys would call you insane.
We have been thoroughly demoralized and our currencies debased. All that is left is the fall, so you go ahead and try and form a “Crusade” to save society, but I’m not going there with you. You spout some high moral sounding motives, good for you…. I’m still not going with you.
I wanted to leave this alone but it looks like it resonates so let me address it. I am NOT advocating saving society or any Crusade. Do you care what happens to *YOU*? Your brother? Your father? That’s how urgent this is. You’re not ushering in a free utopia that you think by rushing this thing along. The next step after ‘Free-range’ isn’t ‘Free-dom’. Its the oven my friend.
Capiche? I’m not talking about saving society. F~~~ them and the lies they rode in on. I’m talking about saving yourself. Do you want to spend the rest of what little free-choice time we have left in drunken stupor after drunken stupor, feeling women at all corners (no assumptions about you personally, just being hypothetical). Or do you want to experience the natural relationships we were all supposed to? Marriage isn’t the only soul-sucking relationship you know. The boss-employee relationship? The govt-citizen relationship? The doctor-patient relationship…ever notice how they all act/seem/work similar to women/marriage i.e. designed to f~~~ you in the ass? What’s the only one of those groups that’s natural (hint::women)? All the others are fake INSTITUTIONS. Oh sure your boss is nice to you now, but he won’t be when TPP railroads you anally with no lube. Well, he’ll smile as he hands you your pink slip.
govern’ment=mind control=to control+ mind in Lat.
@thetruth – to each their own I suppose…
"I care not what others think of what I do, but I care very much about what I think of what I do! That is character!"
~ Theodore RooseveltWhy is is so important for someone to wander in here from time to time in an attempt to polarize MGTOW and give it a cause or direction? I don
t see this place as an echo chamber. Rather I see a bunch of men who share a common paradigm and still have enough common respect for one another to accept the differences from one individual to another. However I don’t personally see a bunch of p~~~ing matches here among the guys trying to convince anyone they are wrong about a particular topic. We are all just doing our own thing and this happens to be a place we gather to compare notes. It just happens that a great deal of our notes have a lot in common. Big deal…we are having a lot of the same experiences at large in the world. Does that make this an echo chamber? Hardly…. Ultimately we dont need nor do we desire anyone to come in here and tell us we are wrong. F~~~ I’ve been married twice. If I wanted to listen to that speech again I’d find another wife!I have never lurked nor even been to this website before today. I’ve mostly lurked at mgtowhq, Nacho’s forum before that and Sandman over at youtube. I think my argument is being misunderstood. That’s probably because its 10 f~~~ing pages, but I’m new to this stream of consciousness s~~~. The reason I’m here is because I’m a man and I’m trying to figure out the truth.
If MGTOW is a method to play me to get me to behave a certain way then I WANT TO KNOW ABOUT. I’m f~~~ing tired of being manipulated into s~~~. Manipulated into relationships, manipulated into school and work and everyother f~~~ing lie in life. If I’m going to burn in hell let it be my choice, don’t destroy my family bonds (which are very beneficial for your health btw), and try to make me blame women and men as f~~~ ups when we’ve all been played against each other from the beginning.
I’m not a woman. I POSTED A CLIP OF ME SPEAKING PROVING I’M A MALE ABOVE. I’m not saying go and get married. The solution is NOT to go back to the plantation. My argument is simple: We’ve been misled on the proper way to behave. This causes problems. MGTOW is like learning you have metabolic disorder and saying F~~~ IT I’M GOING TO EAT ALL THE CAKE I WANT NOW! Which is not to say I’m against MGTOW. I’m saying that AFTER MGTOW destroys the system, we have to be careful we aren’t destroyed along with it. I will say this, without the red pill to guide me I’d be dead or loaded with kids like my friends from school. Instead I’m late twenties single and loving it.
Not ‘we’ as a society, or even as a group. Individually. I’m talking like fema camps.
Anonymous11@Truth: Learn to not be a bull in a china shop, quit trying to force things in life and just enjoy it. Otherwise you’re going to crash and burn hurting only yourself. I now formally retract also thinking you were a woman too.
You obviously have a very high IQ which is very common on this board by the way. Learn how to step out of your intelligence as it will change your perspective. As I mentioned in my first post here, you have many valid points, but you come on too strong. We’re an ornery bunch by nature and love to argue so take nothing as personal.
@thetruth – to each their own I suppose…
That reaction shows that you have been shamed, and mentally tortured throughout your life, which causes you to not only be really defensive, but to also assume the worst is being accused of you and quickly attempt to protect yourself. Such is the power of lies. Men are NATURALLY attracted to young women. Really, men are attracted to all women, but young women of legal age have a much sunnier, carefree (and fatfree too lol) disposition thus making them of higher desireability due to high signs of fitness.
Ask yourself, how many of your reactions, feelings, thoughts and behaviors are YOUR OWN? This is what I meant when I said MGTOW is becoming like an echo chamber. Instead of the rational, logical thinking we pride ourselves of, oftentimes discussions descend into generalizing entire genders (‘alpha male’ ‘beta male’, ‘all women are sluts’) without considering the *individual* motivations of the person. And one man’s irrational fear spreads like wildfire. Just like how they make you think America is less safe due to gun violence, when in fact stats show its never been safer since the 60s!
Hysteria and fear are always the tools of control. Know this, any decision you make based on fear is bound to control you. It is only cold, rational cost-benefit analysis that can save you from marriage traps AND FEAR CONTROL. You have to question things, you cannot just join a movement because it seems right. Because you’re afraid of relationships (not speaking about any here, just say a principle). You should only become a mgtow because it makes sense, as I believe every mgtow does.
HOWEVER, that doesn’t mean that everything you read here is correct. That doesn’t mean you should stop questioning everything. *That doesn’t mean that you shouldn’t be willing to throw down MGTOW in a HOT SECOND if you can PROVE that it is detrimental to your happiness.* Not that that is ever likely, but this is the mindset you have to have if you want the truth. Play time is over gentlemen. You can sleep walk into the furnace or stop the plan (because the plan requires our acquiescence even at this phase of implementation). Where do you think your ‘tax’ dollars go to? Where do you think all those black project funds go to? Hmmm? Wakey wakey gentlemen…
@Truth: Learn to not be a bull in a china shop, quit trying to force things in life and just enjoy it. Otherwise you’re going to crash and burn hurting only yourself. I now formally retract also thinking you were a woman too. You obviously have a very high IQ which is very common on this board by the way. Learn how to step out of your intelligence as it will change your perspective. As I mentioned in my first post here, you have many valid points, but you come on too strong. We’re an ornery bunch by nature and love to argue so take nothing as personal.
I recognize that my style is unconventional, abrasive and hard-to-follow. This is probably why I was banned at mgtowhq, set off too many smell-tests. I’m not actually that smart, it just looks like it because I’ve been able to piece together the research of many, many others. Thanks for the vote of confidence though. Yes, I know of the higher than average IQ, which is why I’m optimistic that many men will at least take the time to refute what I’m saying. I also don’t intend to post much.
I only came here (no offense) because I’ve been banned multiple times at mgtowhq and I really would like to see this issue addressed among the broader mgtow community. Its like we’re turning our hw without checking our answers. I thank you for the welcome and look forward to any discussions we have. I am in a STEM field btw, which may make my online communication seem jilted.
hat reaction shows that you have been shamed, and mentally tortured throughout your life, which causes you to not only be really defensive, but to also assume the worst is being accused of you and quickly attempt to protect yourself.
So, not only do you claim to be a MALE, but now you claim to be able to ‘read’ me because you have some sort of high-level education in psychiatry?? Wow! You are GOOD!!
Bye TROLL!
"I care not what others think of what I do, but I care very much about what I think of what I do! That is character!"
~ Theodore RooseveltWe are NOT in control of anything other than our own personal day to day choices. Period. As with all things in life, The Golden Rule applies; he who has the gold makes the rules. I doubt any of us really has the money to institute real and lasting change. Always follow the money if you want to know who is f~~~ing us all over. It doesn’t get any more real than that because that IS the reality in this country (US). Now we can flounder and froth at the mouth thinking that someone will hear us an institute honest change and you can bet any change that does happen will just be attached to another agenda NOT in our best interests.
I’m 47 years old. I am a complete and whole person without a woman. I don’t NEED a woman. They can all either f~~~ off or suck my b~~~~ and make me a sammich. It makes no difference to me. I spend the fruits of my labor as I see fit. I am pretty goddamn self-aware. Lastly, I’m acutely aware of the current socio-political paradigm. I get it. I just recognize the reality that no commoner (non-millionaires/billionaires) will ever force a true change for the common good. Any change instituted by the money men will surely come with agenda that will put a few more million in someone’s pocket. Personally, I’d rather wait for it all to burn to the ground. Only then MIGHT we see a more truly egalitarian society.
YMMV…
HISTORY...learn from it, memorize it, DON'T repeat it...So are you an MRA or PUA?
HISTORY...learn from it, memorize it, DON'T repeat it...<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>TheTruth wrote:</div>
hat reaction shows that you have been shamed, and mentally tortured throughout your life, which causes you to not only be really defensive, but to also assume the worst is being accused of you and quickly attempt to protect yourself.So, not only do you claim to be a MALE, but now you claim to be able to ‘read’ me because you have some sort of high-level education in psychiatry?? Wow! You are GOOD!! Bye TROLL!
I don’t remember claiming any sort of indoctrina–I mean education besides STEM. I’m ‘reading’ you because I’m doing what I described earlier: I’m moving closer to the female gender talent pool. Women, if this mgtow journey has taught me anything, have a KNACK for spotting bulls~~~. I know, just roll with me for a sec. Anytime a man tries to lie to a woman she catches him or figures him out. Why? Two reasons imo:
1) Women lie *A LOT* more and have more practice; but this only works in a society that values and rewards LIARS AND THIEVES. Honest societies don’t reward this behavior. Ours does.
2) Because women lie a lot more, they’re better and dealing with and detecting it in esp. male reactions because we always act predictably if appearing somewhat irrational to them (because again, they’re not us). So they don’t *understand* our sense of honor or loyalty, but they do *know* about it and how to manipulate it. Because, again that is a female talent, to be able to cut through the bulls~~~.
And now to address that burning question in the back of your heads, *which is why they love guys who can lie to them*. Guys who can convince them that their lie-dar is wrong. Guys who are so smooth that they have to f~~~ him even though they KNOW he’s lying. Mgtow never deals with these kinds of situations. But I digress. I’m sorry if I offended you. I eliminated an earlier paragraph for brevity’s that would’ve cleared up that that was only a surmising on my part, not an elaborate diagnosis.
Anonymous11@Truth: You do a good job of piecing disparate work together. You’re also very passionate both of which are admirable.
Even though it may feel good to go charging into a battle, however, you’re committing suicide by using those tactics rendering yourself useless and letting the feminists win. Sometimes the best thing to do is to be subtle and think strategically as in how do I advance my cause the most effective way. We all have a common enemy in gynocentrism, and we are overwhelmed right now. I want to fight it to free men and all of society including women from the shackles of it, but in the face of an overwhelming enemy one does not go charging in and die in glory for nothing.
In Roman Britain, a rebellion once happened against the Romans by the Britons. A feminist goddess Queen Boudica and her Roman raped daughters were humiliated and the rebellion began. If memory serves correctly, two legions were wiped out by Boudica’s forces. The final battle led by Suetonius was one of the most lopsided victories in history. 80,000 Britons were slaughtered at the cost of 400 Romans. I’ve read estimates on the size of the Roman force of being between around 5,000 to 8,000 men. Suetonius picked a location to fight the Britons where his position was in a gorge where he could not be flanked. Wave after wave of Britons ran into the Roman killing machine only to be hacked to bits. They never stopped until 80,000 Britons were killed and the Roman occupation was cemented. Are you going to be like Boudica or Suetonius?
Slow down and think strategically, and you will accomplish more.
We are NOT in control of anything other than our own personal day to day choices. Period. As with all things in life, The Golden Rule applies; he who has the gold makes the rules. I doubt any of us really has the money to institute real and lasting change. Always follow the money if you want to know who is f~~~ing us all over. It doesn’t get any more real than that because that IS the reality in this country (US). Now we can flounder and froth at the mouth thinking that someone will hear us an institute honest change and you can bet any change that does happen will just be attached to another agenda NOT in our best interests. I’m 47 years old. I am a complete and whole person without a woman. I don’t NEED a woman. They can all either f~~~ off or suck my b~~~~ and make me a sammich. It makes no difference to me. I spend the fruits of my labor as I see fit. I am pretty goddamn self-aware. Lastly, I’m acutely aware of the current socio-political paradigm. I get it. I just recognize the reality that no commoner (non-millionaires/billionaires) will ever force a true change for the common good. Any change instituted by the money men will surely come with agenda that will put a few more million in someone’s pocket. Personally, I’d rather wait for it all to burn to the ground. Only then MIGHT we see a more truly egalitarian society. YMMV…
Thanks for the reply Soul. I’m neither MRA nor PUA. MRA is imo a controlled opposition front. I’m still on the fence about MGTOW as a ‘movement’. Paul-reverse-male-Elam is nothing but an agent provocateur. PUA is for noobs and guys who don’t get(understand) women. I get women. Always have intuitively. No sir, I’m a hardcore MGTOW. No g/f, no kids, I don’t even bang strange anymore ‘cept every couple months. Not for lack of desire, but the risks always seem to overrepresent themselves. Which is partially when I realized that if I was having this reaction, then so were a lot of other guys.
Then I cross-referenced that (this is where I can ‘seem’ intelligent, connecting dots) with the fact that the news lies about gun violence on an almost weekly basis to keep the general populace scared of their neighbors and strangers. Hmmm. cross-ref. with the fact that ALL NEWS is lies (as you will come to find out soon), and I realized that I may be falling into a similar trap as those who are *knee-jerkingly* afraid of guns. perhaps I’m doing the same with women?
BTW notice the word *knee-jerk*. I’m not saying women should be married. Or even taken care of. I’m saying that they provide something to us. I’m saying we need to think rationally. And if we, as men, collectively decide that we no longer need or want that something; not only will our lives suffer tremendously as a result (unless you genuinely don’t see anything redeeming about spending time with a woman), but we will be next-having been the target all along.
Finally Soul, I just want to address one sentiment in your post: the idea that the little guy is screwed and can’t do anything. This is why its important to avoid manipulation. THAT IS WHAT THEY WANT YOU TO THINK. If they could’ve done what they wanted to back then THEY WOULD’VE! They need you to sleepwalk this last mile so that they can win. They NEED YOU to be apathetic, paranoid, FEARFUL. Instead of LOVING (trusting but verifying, or just verifying but still loving). They need you depressed sitting at home alone with nothing to do but watch netflix, or work some more. Because if you can’t have a woman then you can either become spiritual (great path) or materialistic (HORRIBLE path).
The first leads to bliss and happiness (guess which one I chose?) while the second leads to misery, dejection, loneliness, and eventually loss of the ability to appreciate what once was. I.e. if you don’t use it you lose it. The way we think determines how we feel, which determines how we act, which determines what happens to us, which determines how we are. So if you feel powerless, you will act powerless. Nature abhors a vacuum, so you will eventually *become* powerless for real. Be careful what you speak into your life!
I read that wall of text and all I could think was “pasta”. OP went so far as to admit that he/she/it has been spamming various sites with it and that makes me suspicious right off the bat. However, the whole “Are you getting it… really GETTING IT?!” literary shaming device kind of reminded me of a Def Leppard song, which I quite enjoyed.
The second thing I though, about halfway through the first batch of it, was “Ilerminaty!” I have stoner friends who believe in FEMA camps and Lizard Overlords who make more sense than this rant. I kept waiting for the big reveal “Who is doing this to you and why? Pictures at 11!” but it never came. Did any of you get it? Was it it Cthulu and the Illuminati or was it Eris and the Discordians? I lost track somewhere near the middle of the second block.
Here’s the bottom line for me… if some shadowy organization is executing a multi-generational plan to depopulate the world of greedy bitches and hopeless pussies by making them give up in some sort of inverted reflection of going Galt, then I say more power to them. Personally I’m a Discordian so I’d rather throw in with their camp, but at the end of the day it doesn’t matter which side you take, so long as you’re on the winning side.
But for real, did anyone figure this out and, if so, can you summarize it for me?
You do a good job of piecing disparate work together. You’re also very passionate both of which are admirable. Even though it may feel good to go charging into a battle, however, you’re committing suicide by using those tactics rendering yourself useless and letting the feminists win. Sometimes the best thing to do is to be subtle and think strategically as in how do I advance my cause the most effective way. We all have a common enemy in gynocentrism, and we are overwhelmed right now. I want to fight it to free men and all of society including women from the shackles of it, but in the face of an overwhelming enemy one does not go charging in and die in glory for nothing. In Roman Britain, a rebellion once happened against the Romans by the Britons. A feminist goddess Queen Boudica and her Roman raped daughters were humiliated and the rebellion began. If memory serves correctly, two legions were wiped out by Boudica’s forces. The final battle led by Suetonius was one of the most lopsided victories in history. 80,000 Britons were slaughtered at the cost of 400 Romans. I’ve read estimates on the size of the Roman force of being between around 5,000 to 8,000 men. Suetonius picked a location to fight the Britons where his position was in a gorge where he could not be flanked. Wave after wave of Britons ran into the Roman killing machine only to be hacked to bits. They never stopped until 80,000 Britons were killed and the Roman occupation was cemented. Are you going to be like Boudica or Suetonius? Slow down and think strategically, and you will accomplish more.
I appreciate the advice. You are correct. But my alpha energy doesn’t stay with me in one place for too long. I may not post again for a week (spent instead learning jazz voicings, or listening to the news in a foreign language). Furthermore, a lot of this information, these guesses and connections need to be flushed out the moment they are hinted upon or they leave me and I have to wait until I see something to retrigger that thought. Also, I probably won’t convince anyone here. That’s ok. This is for lurkers. Young men who are confused. I want them to realize that they don’t have to choose between (fake) love and hatred. They can LOVE women without being subservient to them.
If you look at the ‘anectdotals’ section of mgtowhq, you’ll see many horror stories of women behaving badly etc. But you know what you wont see? You won’t see all the women crying because they don’t have a bf. You won’t see all the women who are hurt, and sad, and alone and seek solace in their g/fs or ‘school’ or ‘programs’. Which is not to say we should have sympathy for those women, they made their beds like the blue-piller makes his. But, you should be careful of being skewed by statistics without the full data. Its like those videos where they show how stupid the average American is.
These videos are usually worthless because they never tell you how many people they ask. And they also never take into account the substantial *dumbing down* of the population.And you know what else you don’t see? You don’t see all the happy people who are in love but free from the societal burdens of ‘marriage’ and etc. Again, you shouldn’t run back to any plantation. You shouldn’t go through life thinking you ‘need’ a woman to complete you. But to fully deny it means to deny part of your humanity. Make sure that is what you want to do.
Very tangential to your point I know.
I read that wall of text and all I could think was “pasta”…. I kept waiting for the big reveal “Who is doing this to you and why? Pictures at 11!” but it never came. Did any of you get it? Was it it Cthulu and the Illuminati or was it Eris and the Discordians? I lost track somewhere near the middle of the second block.
Ha, that is how I feel. I have ignored this thread up until now, but it is the only one getting any movement so I followed along, trying to connect the thousands of dots splattered all over the thread like a bag of peas dropped off the Empire State building.
"You don't know a woman till you have met her in divorce court."- AuthorPosts
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