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AB 2 years, 8 months ago.
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Hi everybody!
Obviously I’m new around here – so be gentle:
I’m a 45 yr old guy living in Brisbane Australia. Life seemed acceptable but dull for many years and the mind numbing monotony of middle class suburban existence with wife and 2 children left me utterly unfulfilled and feeling like a packhorse working hard for no enjoyment in life whatsoever. Wife seemed to revel in her time with the kids, seemed to resent time I spent with them and made no attempt whatsoever to acknowledge the pressures of the financial situation, announcing her plans and aspirations frequently without considering the implications of her lofty ambitions.
A few years ago, after increasing arguments over money, decreasing intimacy and a general malaise I did what many other before me have also done. I responded to the attention and interest of a younger woman – a former colleague with whom I shared a good friendship and bond. We got drunk… and we admitted our attraction to each other. Over the next few weeks we met often, spoke constantly and f~~~ed wildly. – All very text-book. She knew I was married and had kids, but she also knew that I was unhappy.
Obviously the marital situation at home didnt stand much chance of holding up or improving and before long it became clear I had to change things up. I moved away from my sexless wife and moved in my new girlfriend 16 years younger than me and considerably more financially secure! I was still spending a lot of time at the former home when wife was working shifts. Kids needed stability and I was there for them as much as I could be. It didnt seem appropriate for them to be around the new girlfriend, so I split my life between venues, balancing between kids and family responsibilities and a girlfriend who made me happy.
Life seemed pretty good for a while – except in the interests of keeping the peace and allowing feeling to be processed and get amicable settlements I was still paying a FORTUNE to my wife for all her costs and living almost entirely off the charity of my girlfriend. Wife and I attended some counselling sessions, in the hope (from my end) of trying to understand that our relationship had died and that we could move on separately without going to war. From her perspective she was hoping I would “see sense/the error of my ways” and return to being the loving husband.
Then after a few months, it got weird…..
My wife seemed to change (hindsight gives me a much more interesting take on this) – the anger subsided, the levels of cooperation increased, the acknowledgement of neglect and really oddly her libido seemed to experience a resurgence. When we crossed paths (as we do frequently with kids involved) she pretty much jumped me. There was only so much resistance I could muster….
The guilt I felt for ‘cheating’ on the ever supporting and understanding girlfriend was tough. How could I do that? Surely that meant I was not 100% committed to her? Was I just using her for financial and emotional support? This wasnt any way to treat a friend. Perhaps with a resurgent and newly understanding wife I could rescue the family situation?
I tool a hard (and misguided) decision to leave girlfriend and nervously move back to the family home. We agreed we’d try to address the lifestyle problems we had identified in the counselling sessions and attempt to rebuild something better.
I wanted changed our diet, I committed to an exercise regime and get us all off the couch. I was not going to sit in front of the TV and atrophy away. My family would be active and healthy. We’d do things together. We’d work at improving the run down s~~~-hole that the house had become. We’d share the burdens and split the financial responsibilities.
It didnt work.
I got fit and quit TV, the rest of my family ignored me (I’ve since run 4 marathons with another in 2 weeks time). I wanted to improve the diet – but the wife kept dragging us to McDs…. It seemed the harder I tried to make positive lifestyle changes, the further away she was from doing the same. Her “12 week body transformation” plan (she’d gained at least 20kg since we were married) lasted 2 days before she decided she couldnt be botehred. Her attempts to develop a hobby and start playing a musical instrument ended after 3 weeks. She had no enthusiasm for anything, and we found ourselves less engaged with each other than ever. The money situation hadnt really changed, I was still paying for everything, she was still spending like a drunken sailor. To top it all the venomous hatred in my wife that my ‘straying’ had created bubbled up again and I became increasingly angry at her that I’d thrown away and hurt a good friend (and nymphomaniac!) who had done nothing beside support me.
Last year I called time and decided that enough was enough. I moved into a rental, my kids could stay with me for the 50% of the time they needed to, and I was going it alone. I was going moving out not to be with someone else, but to be with ME.
Oddly enough, I still needed to keep paying for things. I knew that if I pulled out my support the kids would be punished. They’d be pulled out of their school, they’d be made almost homeless. Nothing was their fault – so I kept bailing things out. Still hopeful that such benevolence would increase the chances of an amicable split when it finally comes to the inevitable divorce. If we could avoid a heated legal battle, we could save $50-$60k of legal fees – and given the 50/50 parenting is always agreed and uncontested, the arguments of division of assets would only ever be fine details anyway (40/60? 50/50?). Amicable is clearly the better way to go.
A year later and the wife is still dragging her feet. I make suggestions of ways of dividing assets and future responsibilities, but I get nothing in return. I know if I have to get legal she’ll come off a lot worse off and I dont want to do that – but patience is running thin.
So thats the background…. I know that post-divorce my income could effectively rise quite dramatically through cutting out some of those unnecessary expenses (paying for a house I dont actually live in!) – but in order to get there, I may have to the hard-ass bastard I didnt want to.
I’d be really intrigued to hear the perspectives of guys around here. Some of you have no doubt been though the process of marital separation – did any of you manage to negotiate those waters without being embittered? I dont want to hurt my ex-wife. I just have no desire whatsoever to look after her any more! Its time to look after me for once.
Its time to look after me for once.
Exactly!!
I cannot help with advice on separation but, welcome brother.
welcome,
i’ve been in a divorce that went stagnant for over 4 years.
i don’t want to harm the ex,
we have a kid and that’s more important than anything.
so it goes on and on..
i’ve developed the patience of a saint..
and have been as civil as possible to the ex.
at first it was tough.
but it’s in everyone’s best interest.
check this thread friend..
Anonymous1Welcome brother, a young men going his own way here, sorry but I definitely can’t give you any useful advise, however I appreciate the time you put and your decision to post your story here, since we the young ones, at least in my opinion, can learn immensely from you guys, and also soon you’ll find great advise from even greater members of this site.
Welcome
You fell into the trap of solving one problem by creating another one. It’s common. Trading one woman for another. Pussy doesn’t fix anything. If you can step back long enough from women and just fix what you can and get stable you will think clearly. I’m not suggesting give up sex forever, but you might want to try for now and strongly focus on yourself.I wanted to improve the diet – but the wife kept dragging us to McDs….
Dragging you down but in more ways than just diet..
I dont want to hurt my ex-wife. I just have no desire whatsoever to look after her any more! Its time to look after me for once.
That’s good plan. Don’t hurt her and worry about you.
If you rescue a damsel in distress, all you will get is a distressed damsel.
Welcome. I visited Brisbane twice while in the US Navy. Got bit in the ass by an ostrich at the Lone Pine National Koala Reserve. Not as bad as my divorce from my first wife, however. Sorry for your predicament, but everyone here has been bitten in the ass at one time or another by women. I hope you’ll find direction and support here.
"Don't follow in my footsteps...I stepped in something."
Anonymous0Welcome home, Marathon Man
Beer’s in the fridge.I tried to be nice during my divorce/separation.
She did not.
If you want to get through it without getting divorce raped, you will have to go to war and be that Sob that you do not want to be.
Next item:
She could be dragging her feet on the divorce issue because she is still the beneficiary of your will and life insurance. Has she been asking about that? After all, there is plenty of time to screw you over in court, as long as you are paying the bills now. After the kids are on their own, she could hit you up for a huge alimony because (sarcasm on) she had to take care of the children because you abandoned them (sarcasm off) That’s the way it will be made to sound in court. Do not trust her.After the kids are on their own, she could hit you up for a huge alimony because (sarcasm on) she had to take care of the children because you abandoned them (sarcasm off) That’s the way it will be made to sound in court.
I appreciate the cautious tone – however having gotten a little legal advice and researched divorce here in Australia, things seem to be a little better here than in many other places. I know that if the kids werent in the mix then there’d be no ‘alimony’ case to answer whatsoever. Divorce is a “No fault” state here – so if child custody is not an issue, divorce settlements are almost always a 50/50 division of the combined asset pool.
However, a disparity in incomes and presence of kids complicate things.:
– With no accusations of abuse and already plenty of documented evidence of agreement that 50/50 custody is agreed (and currently in place) it would be almost unthinkable that a court would suggest otherwise.
– Asset division tends to go broadly along lines with the children, but in cases of income disparity there can be a decision made slightly in favour of the lesser earning parent in order to assist with child costs.From a legal perspective ongoing costs are almost never awarded in terms of “alimony” – but the Australian CSA (Child Support Agency) does have power to redistribute income in line with their published guidelines based on percentage of care of the child and both parents incomes. Being 50/50 custody any child support payable will be minimal – and end as soon as the child hits 18 (I’m currently paying about 6-7x the amount the agency would enforce based on our current incomes).
Most of the stories I’ve heard from Australian complaining of ‘divorce ass-raping’ come from complaints about lawyers stringing things on, charging a fortune and not really doing anything – more than the courts making grossly unreasonable decisions. (Of course there are exceptions and some guys do manage to get f~~~ed over)
Rip off that bandaid! it’s your only hope to get off that train.
Involvement is your biggest mistake.
A MGTOW is a man who is not a woman's bitch!
Get out as fast as you can, then you have earning investing years for yourself,,,
Your tale is the same as all marriages, yet some poor bastards swallow the s~~~ life forever..
Wow. Very similar to my story. The massive weight gain. The affair. The attempts to make a go of it.
If you had stayed you would have been dragged back into unhealthy lifestyles. I think there are a lot of dead men who could not lose weight while the wife was packing the fridge full of addictive deadly food. Women aren’t aa prone to heart attacks u til after the menopause. They can be fat most of their long lives. So you probably literrally saved your life.
My ex often defaults on her share of the mortgage. I have had to play hard ball and say I won’t cover her share. The house will be repossessed and the boys will have to live with me. You don’t need a lawyer to tell her that. It’s simple economics. The foil in the plan is if she doesn’t care enough about the kids and would rather they have the stress than get off her fat arse and work.
Is she on a dating site yet posting photos of how she was 20 years ago?MarathonMan, you are in a similar situation to me in my last divorce. We had no children, and no real property. We were married for 16 years. In that 16 years she may have brought enough income to the marriage to equal my best year. I raised her daughter and for a couple of years, took care of her eldest with her kids and full-time-permanent-student husband. Anything she wanted, I did my dead level best to get it for her. After 10 years, she flat told me she could no longer stomach sex with me, but insisted she still loved me. I never strayed; never even seriously looked at another woman. For the last 2 years of our marriage, she decided she was “disabled” with fibromyalgia. Of course the best treatment for that is to stay as active as possible, but she took to the bed, and stayed there playing on the computer. She never got up unless she wanted to do something. She came home moaning like a cow, and swore she would never do that again… till the next time. I did the shopping, the laundry, the house work (bear in mind I am, and was retired on disability), and the cooking, much more often than not served her meals in bed. The last 6 months of our marriage, I tried to convince her she wasn’t disabled, and she had just given up on life, all to denials and no avail. I finally gave up. I couldn’t stand to see her give up. I didn’t want to hurt her. I still cared for her, and knew if I left her, I would lose my step-daughter and my grandchildren. It was a terrible decision, but I had to choose myself. By the time I left, I felt truly beaten and abused. I made it quick, and painful. As someone else put it, I had to just “rip the band-aid off”. In the end it was the best decision. Since we separated (and later divorced) she has had heart bypass surgery, and survived cancer. Even now, she does more every week than she did in the last two years we were married. It was the best thing for both of us. We got past the separation and divorce, and remained amicable. With her illnesses, I still help her on occasion, as needed. I did lose the love and respect of my step-kids and am denied access to my grandchildren. My steps feel I abandoned their mother in her time of worst need (though they don’lift a finger, or spend a dime to help her). My older step thinks I am an absolute piece of s~~~ (she has told me so) and broken all contact. I am the only grandfather my grandkids have ever known. I truly miss them, but it would not have been a reason to stay. If I had, I think we may both be dead. So, as bstoffers said, just rip the band-aid off. It has to end somewhere.
I don’t believe in female magic anymore. And will never again gut myself to make room for it. --Narwhal--
Anonymous13Welcome.
Women are just C~~~S in divorce.
Whatever or however this plays out, look after yourself and your best interests.
No one else will look after you, especially the c~~~.
Welcome to the Forums. Your story is mirrored many times over here. Begin the search for Absolute Truth now.
When women lead, destruction is the destination. -- Me.
Epic evening last night….
Kids are with me this week and because I’m about to go away for 2 weeks (running London Marathon) – we decided to have a celebration dinner as I’ll be missing eldest kids 13th birthday while I’m away. As a gesture of goodwill I’d invited ‘soon-to-be-ex-wife’ to join us, thinking we could manage to behave as ordinary adults for an evening and just make it about the kids.
Unfortunately when wife called to confirm details of where/when she quickly moved from that into attack mode talking about property division and how she needed to be compensated for having her life ripped away from her involuntarily. Odd that she should argue this since the deal I’d suggested was one far better than any court around here would offer in the vague hope of trying to keep things civil and find a way of keeping her in that house and giving the kids the continuity that would provide. It didnt matter how much I tried to explain that the offer on the table was the only way I could see of her being able to afford to remain in the house and that bitter arguments and falling back to lawyers to get resolution would mean we’d both be poorer, her a LOT so…. The argument raged on
After some considerable time and a number of old favourite arguments got recycled I suggested that perhaps her joining us for dinner was not such a great idea after all. If we couldnt have a civil conversation then being together in front of the kids was a bad idea. Our conversation ended with me having to hang up.
I ignored the 20-30 txt messages… the 4 or 5 missed calls – and proceeded to have a pleasant evening out with my kids.
Later on – with everyone safely tucked up in bed, my eldest came into my room handing me their phone saying, “Mum wants to talk to you”…
Arguments raged on – with no rational direction, just a torrent of anger, threats of suicide etc etc.
I’m livid that she pulled the kids into the middle of the argument, I’m livid that she tries to pull emotional blackmail stunts like threatening to kill herself – and today I just feel like s~~~.
The temptation to file for a DVO (I’ve checked the legislation and threatening suicide IS part of the definition of D0omestic Violence in QLD. I am a legitimate victim of DV!) to stop her harrassing me and go fully legal to ‘rip off the bandaid’ is growing.
If she wants to fight – she WILL lose big. How much longer can I continue to take the high road?
I don’t know that can, or should go on…. Maybe, for the kids sake, take your offer to court, and show it to the judge. He’ll see it is more generous than the court award, and order your offer in favor of the kids. Maybe it could be that easy; maybe that’s too much to hope for. Or, you could follow up on the DVO, have her declared incompetent, and keep the kids and the house, giving her “every other weekend & 1 holiday a year”…… Maybe even get child support from her. My brother did that.
I don’t believe in female magic anymore. And will never again gut myself to make room for it. --Narwhal--
Anonymous3MarathonMan,
Welcome to the forums.
I wish to share with you a revelation I once had, something I said to my wife in a fight:
Nobody, in my entire life, has ever insulted me in such thorough, vicious and hurtful manner as her.And this is on an apparently ‘good marriage’. What would she do in a divorce?
Women are set to destroy a man, that they supposedly support and love.
But when a separation occurs, their only objective in life is his total annihilation, by whatever means necessary.
There is nothing they will not use. Children are not of limits, it is THEIR PRIMARY WEAPON. It is so commonplace that it appears to be mandatory.
They do not care about anyone but themselves. The only protection a man has is if he shows to be ruthless and capable of destroying them. Then they will put the reasonable mask and take the role of victim.
I will not just state this, I will show you why they act like this:
Women are the ultimate pragmatics, they feel what is usefull for their situation.
If they are in acquisition mode, the really feel ‘love’ and ‘tenderness’. But once the victim is acquired through marriage the get over it and enter ‘normal’ operation. That is a state of indecision in-between staying and leaving, usefull to prepare them to jump to a better provider.
When they are abandoned instead of abandoning, then THE ONLY USEFULL EMOTION TO THEM IS PURE HATE.
That is what happens when you use permanent emotional memory, every small ‘bad’ thing you supposedly did is there the whole time calling out for revenge.
You cannot reason.
You cannot expect recognition.
You cannot hope to do her any good, because in the limit she will destroy herself just to get to you.I would advise you not to feed this emotional fire. Drop any conversation that is not purely practical. Get totally unemotional and unresponsive. There should be no arguments, disconnected at the first sign, without even a warning.
Abandon even common courtesy, use it like a formula:”hi, the kids are ready, goodbye.(click)”Cover you ass like all your worst enemies where out to get you. Because she really is your worst enemy.
Rip off that bandaid! it’s your only hope to get off that train.
I was actually going to write this exact same thing. MarathonMan if you want this to continue for the next 4 plus years keep doing what you are doing. Your wife is in no rush to get a divorce in fact why should she now that she has the best of both worlds? You are no longer living at “her” house and you are paying for everything anyway what incentive does she have to cut the rope holding her up when she doesn’t have to do anything.
No matter how you look at it the law is stacked against you there is no getting out of this without some blood loss. Best to just get your life in order the sooner you do it the better because as time goes on the more money you may have to pay out to her the longer you are married. Talk to a lawyer today and get it resolved as fast as the courts will allow you. The lawyer you have will love to drag this out because more money in both your wife and the lawyers pockets.
Try this perhaps – Negotiate hard using a lawyer, give nothing until the deal is close to being concluded. Then look at it and decide how much slack you can give her and the kids. She will become bitter and make some terrible moves, this will cause her to feel better when you actually do come though in the end. If the deal allows you to come through. If you get divorce raped then you can just accept the deal you were going to get anyway.
Let the good times roll
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