Home › Forums › The Litter Box › mgtow: Not Far Enough
Tagged: celibacy, define MGTOW, mgtow definition
This topic contains 101 replies, has 26 voices, and was last updated by 
v9wlmn8c1982 4 years, 6 months ago.
- AuthorPosts
Wow, too many posts. Figure out its a chick yet?
Philosophy, the female repellent
Anonymous18Brother:
I think you may need to re-evaluate the term MGTOW, and possibly your understanding of it as it applies to you.
And in doing so, make it crystal clear who we are, what we’re doing and why we’re doing it.
You are not me. I am not you. I’m following my own path, and while I may choose to share with you why and how I am doing it, that action does not make it tantamount to your path or revelations. Nor should it. Lumping people together got us into the car-wreck that is modern society.
Men Going Their Own Way. You are going to have your own concept of what your own way is, and no one can tell you any differently. This will not necessarily reflect at all on how I feel. I and hopefully others have absolutely no intention as an organization to tell you what your way will be. MGTOW’s in my opinion, if anything, are fairly tired of “organized” in general. Organized religion, organized socio-political boundaries, organized special interest groups. A great many of those concepts have led us right to where we stand in society. Ironically, alone.
Confusing this dot com presence of men going their own way, with that of a cult, commune, hive, movement, collective or otherwise will defeat the very purpose of having this place, in my opinion. This place was rather brilliantly designed to promote individuality, rather than a collective hive of thinking. I am sure many will disagree, and far be it for me to impugn the nature and intentions of the creator of this place.
The very beauty of this place is that it isn’t a movement.
We can leave mobs of people, mindlessly chanting the same thing over and over again without evaluating it to the feminists. If there is one common thread here, we tend not to like or respect them or their hive-programmed minds very much at all.
Commonalities are one thing. And it is a blessing that we have a place to gather where we might discuss them. However, before I found this place, I was going my own way. If this place, horribly, were to disappear tomorrow, I would still be going my own way. It’s been an oasis in the desert for me; as the camaraderie increases with the concept, so does the thinking of other men enlighten me.
This place has been a great validation for so many of the issues which have plagued my life. My membership here does not however, hinge on me agreeing with anyone on anything, apart from a basic set of rules which have been laid out to make this a functioning and respectful environment. If I am so obtuse as to undermine the intentions of another, I would however consider that dishonorable, and would hope for my discharge from the place. Especially since I personally don’t take THAT s~~~ from anyone. In my opinion, this place is freedom for men who have experienced some very real traumas in their lives due to following what one “should” do. Especially for slightly older generations. We were spoon-fed what we should do. How we should behave. How we should succumb. This is not a place of “shoulds”. This is a place of “Wills”. In every sense of the word. I Will myself to obtain freedom from the shackles of my past. And I Will succeed. I Will not be organized into a group who must follow the intentions of a superior.
I like to think of this place as a great stone Keep, set in the middle of a scorched and post-apocalyptic land. A cataclysmic event has happened, and the fallout is real, present and ongoing. After trudging endlessly through this barren land, I saw in the distance a fortification. One of promise. It’s design was so elaborate that at first it seemed deceptively simple in it’s presentation. I needed shelter, and I was welcome to enter.
If I were able to follow a few very basic codes of conduct, ones which have endured in men for thousands of years, I was to be given harbor and safe passage. This Keep was full of many fellow travelers. Some were absolutely torn to shreds from their travels. Some were possessed of an anger which could barely be voiced for lack of words due to their mistreatment at the hands of their oppressors, and from the punishment of the storm. Others simply needed to rest, needing peace, protection and refuge so that they might continue with their quest. There was no question; they were all embarked on very different voyages, having set out on each of their own journeys, and all from very different origins. But there was commonality in that they all needed refuge from a land; a land which would take from their provisions, their love for humankind, their leather bag of coins, and from their very soul itself. The land would do this all while giving absolutely nothing back. By way of the Keep, men were free to drink, free to rest, free from the voice of the storm, and free from the very voice of their respective oppressors. The men were free to speak of their individual quest, and free to learn from their fellow travelers as to how they might better weather the storm upon embarking once again on their journey. While the gate had been drawn to prevent those who would enter to harm or silence them, each traveler was free to come and leave as they chose. So long as they obeyed a simple code of conduct: Respect for their fellow travelers, and respect for those who built the keep.
And should I feel weary again? I will return, and hopefully there will be new men to enlighten me in my struggle.
I think I just ….got schooled by a headmaster. I don’t know. Bow master.
Standing next to a renowned surgeon in OR I was told “to pay close attention to the words (while reading), don’t just memorize. Close your eyes. Think. They all mean something.”
I think of a handful of times a light bulb went on in my head, and reading this is one of them. Its really is a “aha” moment.
I am a big fan of The Alchemist and that read like an excerpt from the book. And I would do Fatima in the oasis … that’s going my way.
Very interesting topic. Lots of aha moments. Thanks for every contribution, including the topic starter. I celebrate people speaking up and the debate that ensues, regardless of validity of an argument. Stirring the pot is essential step in any good recipe.
Couple points:
1) You can only change yourself, thinking you can change society is childish and idealistic = very far from reality
Let’s face it – MGTOW is a fringe idea – far from mainstream. Any changes would require MGTOW to be a dominant idea, not a fringe one. This of course would have been nice, but let’s talk about it when it actualizes.
2) this is not a SJW platform, this isn’t socialism or social engineering gig, this is a refuge. A place where you can share ideas and talk freely without any PC bulls~~~, without people calling you misogynist. Let’s keep it that way.
3) entry requirements for calling yourself a MGHOW is counterproductive effort. The only requirement is a Y chromosome
“The only requirement of AA is a desire to stop drinking” Same applies here. Variety and pluralism creates value, not otherwise. Stealthy MGTOW aka Batcave for example is married. Should we “delete” him? F~~~ NO! I love that guy. Every contribution is valuable. Celibacy? Atheism? What else should we constitute as a requirement? Being a republican? Vegetarian? Having facial hair maybe???? What else?
4) “Let’s face it – we don’t get sex” – you’re projecting your own experiences on others. Grow the f~~~ upproud carrier of the 'why?' chromosome
F~~~ing a woman is pointless
Ultimately so is everything. Eventually you are going to die. You might as well enjoy yourself while you’re here.
And of course sex is risky. So are most fun things. Riding motorcycles is risky. But risk is manageable. If you’re going to ride motorcycles, wear appropriate clothing and put on a goddamn helmet. If you’re going to have sex with women, get a vasectomy and put on a goddamn condom.
it’s about putting sex as a whole on a pedestal.
Who is doing that? The only people I know who put sex on a pedestal are the ones who aren’t having sex. It’s been my observation the people who have the most sex tend to get a little, well blasé about it, if not actually jaded. That’s hardly putting sex on a pedestal.
For myself, given the choice between having sex with a woman or seeing a movie with her, I usually choose the movie. We can always have sex when we get to her place after, but showtimes are on a fixed schedule. Is that putting sex on a pedestal? I don’t think so.
if a MGTOW decides to get laid, he is actually tempering the pussy market value. If he uses a skank to f~~~ and chuck, who cares because she is always going to be a slut – zero sum. If he has a woman with some brains, and she can handle being held at arms length, he may mitigate her ego to a degree – positive.
I look at it this way: If a MGTOW is f~~~ing some slore WITHOUT surrendering resources to her he is keeping her from f~~~ing some other poor blue pill schmuck who might fall for her trap. When you think about it, it’s a noble thing taking a blowjob for the team.
F~~~ing is natural
Marriage is notI never condone anything natural
proud carrier of the 'why?' chromosome
I never condone anything natural
Pretty sure you meant to write “unnatural” there. But yeah, that’s pretty much it.
Hell, even long term pairbonding for the purpose of raising children is natural, but feminists have so completely s~~~ in the soup that even that’s ruined and done with.
Exsliventxs, I was talking about pursuing sex, not just sexual acts. There is a crucial difference, because men do the vast majority of pursuing the opposite sex. Women turn down a much larger number of sexual advances than men do, on average. The female ego is not fed by the f~~~ing but the being pursued.
It still levels out, because for every few thousand of minor ego boosts a woman gets for being hit on and chased, the average man gets an ego x 10000 boost when he actually nails the woman he targeted.
That is precisely the problem. If you break down the entire experience of sex, you will find that its value for the average man is not just in the physical pleasure and the intimacy. Much of it is in the validation. Sure, men have powerful sex drives that influence our thoughts, feelings and behavior particularly in our youth. As sexual beings, we crave for validation in the eyes of the opposite sex. But that is not the whole story. We also have an instinctual craving for status and that drive is even more powerful than our sex drive. Without status, there was no chance of sex or even survival in our evolutionary past. Everything that we value collectively has a strong tendency to be mythologized and thus artificially inflated in perceived value. You will see this tendency in action in every context where people congregate, share experiences and ideas, and bond. In the case of PUA communities, this is manifested by the greek alphabet mythology. What started out as merely men co-operating in learning the methods of seduction long ago rapidly developed into a full-blown ideologically driven system with an intellectual underpinning in popularized concepts evolutionary biology and with clear hierarchies and intense status competition despite the fact that the community is merely a loose virtual one.
I recommend that men, MGHOWs in particular, engage in the mental excercise of stripping away all hype and mythos from their experience of sex and determining its actual instrinsic value. Stardusk as discussed this topic in some of his videos and I have to concur with him. Men are, of course, different in this regard. Some men enjoy the mere act of sex more than others. However, if men collectively stepped back and evaluated sex for its intrinsic value, the net effect would be a marked shift of power from women to men.
If it wasn’t some sort of equal transaction, one of the two genders would have completely fallen out with the other, and as you can see everything still works to a degree, other than government and feminism f~~~ing with their heads and ruining marriage….
Sex is an equal transaction only under specific circumstances that we do not live under in today’s modern world. Sex and relationships in general are an equal transaction only under a patriarchal system where the value what men bring to the table in relationships is actually recognized by society and the legal system. Family courts, yes-means-yes -laws, average women getting their egos stroked by thousands upon thousands of men in the online world of dating apps together with constant male bashing and rampant negative stereotyping have created an environment where men have much lose and little to gain in sexual relationships with women.
I highly recommend Turd Flinging Monkey’s theories of patriarchy, traditionalism, feminism and social evolution. Check out his channel if you haven’t already.
The only “movement” I’m willing to consider is when I void my bowels. I do that in private whenever possible.
Society asks MGTOWs: Why are you not making more tax-slaves?
..I need to take a shower after reading this s~~~.
-----------
The thing is, it’s a drug that has dire consequences for a man if he isn’t careful.
I don’t recall saying anything about not being careful. Anyone can argue that ANY action one partakes in is going to change the world ala butterfly effect. But the state of sex as we know it is at where it’s at, and with as far gone as it is, you’re going to be insignificant in your pursuit in not having it. Regardless of MGTOW, I wish you luck in convincing the remainder of the world’s population in engaging in celibacy. If you think that my banging a woman who has come to me to have sex, is going to be a concern for me you’re sorely mistaken. I’ve got it under control 😉 Things might well be playing out for you in that manner, but they aren’t for me. Nor would I allow them to.
I’m not choosing to not have sex to change the world, I don’t care for it. This world cannot be changed, too many people are far gone. However I’m just pointing out what the problem is.
I couldn’t care less what other people do. But since this thread is brought up, just thought I’d put my opinion on it. Men who can’t control their sexual urges are partly to blame for this. They treat the self-entitled whores like a goddess and this is what happens, you get a society of masculine women and emasculated men and all the s~~~ that goes with it.
F~~~ing a woman is pointless
Ultimately so is everything. Eventually you are going to die. You might as well enjoy yourself while you’re here. And of course sex is risky. So are most fun things. Riding motorcycles is risky. But risk is manageable. If you’re going to ride motorcycles, wear appropriate clothing and put on a goddamn helmet. If you’re going to have sex with women, get a vasectomy and put on a goddamn condom.
it’s about putting sex as a whole on a pedestal.
Who is doing that? The only people I know who put sex on a pedestal are the ones who aren’t having sex. It’s been my observation the people who have the most sex tend to get a little, well blasé about it, if not actually jaded. That’s hardly putting sex on a pedestal. For myself, given the choice between having sex with a woman or seeing a movie with her, I usually choose the movie. We can always have sex when we get to her place after, but showtimes are on a fixed schedule. Is that putting sex on a pedestal? I don’t think so.
Well that’s just it right there. Men complaining about whores and at the same time wanting to ” enjoy themselves ” with the same whores they complain about. A woman cannot be a whore if no man will f~~~ her. So let’s think that men liking whores just for sex isn’t part of the problem because it us. They can only self entitled and thinking they’re better because men give them that power and then those same men will complain that women are taking advantage.And the other point, about putting sex on a pedestal. My point is it should be on a pedestal, not cheapened into some drug induced fix that most people treat it as now. But hey I realise I’m in the 0.5% of sanity here. We now live in a world where it’s all about me me me and how much pleasure I can achieve and then we wonder there’s so many miserable f~~~ers walking around depressed.Well that’s just it right there. Men complaining about whores and at the same time wanting to ” enjoy themselves ” with the same whores they complain about. A woman cannot be a whore if no man will f~~~ her. So let’s think that men liking whores just for sex isn’t part of the problem because it us. They can only self entitled and thinking they’re better because men give them that power and then those same men will complain that women are taking advantage.
It is really very simple. You lose the right to complain about sluts with high notch counts if you participate in creating them. The exact same logic applies to littering. Everybody agrees a man who throws litter to the ground while complaining there’s too much litter on the ground is a joke.
It is really very simple. You lose the right to complain about sluts with high notch counts if you participate in creating them. The exact same logic applies to littering. Everybody agrees a man who throws litter to the ground while complaining there’s too much litter on the ground is a joke.
I highly doubt any MGTOW is participating in any meaningful way to create sluts.
I think you’re confusing us with PUAs. Wrong website. I highly doubt anyone would go celibate for the reasons given, just as I highly doubt that any MGTOW is chasing pussy enough to significantly contribute to slut creation.
Also, let it be known that slut is a mentality of promiscuity, if she doesn’t f~~~ you, she’ll f~~~ someone else. This analogy with litter is not sufficient because litter doesn’t have a consciousness to litter itself.
Also, let it be known that slut is a mentality of promiscuity, if she doesn’t f~~~ you, she’ll f~~~ someone else. This analogy with litter is not sufficient because litter doesn’t have a consciousness to litter itself.Indeed she’ll f~~~ someone else. But the scenario would be simple, that if all men went celibate then there would be no whores or sluts. They can’t exist if nobody is f~~~ing. Not realistic I know, but it is the ultimate way to defeat these women with there disgusting behaviour which is what the OP was trying to suggest. The thing is, nobody likes being told they should do this or should do that. So I’m not telling men they ” should ” be celibate because it will be ignored anyhow. But it is the solution.Men can claim to be going their own way but if they’re still f~~~ing what they know are whores, then they aren’t really. They’re going her way of supplying her resources still. So nothing will change, because all society is geared towards giving the woman want they want at the expense of men and these men are still participating in that. The ultimate power women have over men is their sexuality and of course the laws of land are close up there. Defeat the need for sex is the way to bring these women down that pedestal.Indeed she’ll f~~~ someone else. But the scenario would be simple, that if all men went celibate then there would be no whores or sluts. They can’t exist if nobody is f~~~ing. Not realistic I know, but it is the ultimate way to defeat these women with there disgusting behaviour which is what the OP was trying to suggest. The thing is, nobody likes being told they should do this or should do that. So I’m not telling men they ” should ” be celibate because it will be ignored anyhow. But it is the solution. Men can claim to be going their own way but if they’re still f~~~ing what they know are whores, then they aren’t really. They’re going her way of supplying her resources still. So nothing will change, because all society is geared towards giving the woman want they want at the expense of men and these men are still participating in that. The ultimate power women have over men is their sexuality and of course the laws of land are close up there. Defeat the need for sex is the way to bring these women down that pedestal.
Giving the woman a dick, at the expense of blood being pooled to your dick, does not give the woman anything she wants that you aren’t willing to give her. Dick.
I don’t see how she will gain anything financially if you are even half mindful about your sexual encounter.
Also, I like to deal with realistic solutions, celibacy on the level needed to actually have an affect on women’s behavior as a whole is unattainable.
I like your ideological model but it won’t work, to me it sounds like communism.
If everyone shared everything equally, it would be superior to capitalism. True, but in reality it never works that way, so communism is not a model for a functional government in reality. The track record of many failed attempts is it’s own evidence.
I treat this celibacy angle with the same logic.
Beware the Lamiae does have a point in that each time a man actively pursues sex, he is increasing female power at the very least by feeding their egos
How the f~~~ does that not work exactly the same in both directions?
Men actively pursue sex much more frequently than women.
Heterosexual men and women have close to equal numbers. It is mathematically impossible for the average heterosexual woman to have more sex than the average heterosexual man.
So celibate men aren’t being counted in this example?
All heterosexual men and women are counted. The completely celibate of both sexes have zero as their partner count, obviously. (It should read “sex partners” instead of “sex” in the above quote.)
Then how does being celibate as MGTOW have an effect as Beware is claiming?
I don’t think refusing sex when offered is strictly necessary. Only not pursuing it at all is necessary to have the effect of completely removing pussy power from a man’s life. (That’s a tall order, of course.)
I suppose if women want to stop empowering the patriarchy they should be celibate as well?
There is no patriarchy left to empower. There is no power at all to be gained for women over men by walking out of sexual relations with men. Women can’t survive or even run society without men.
It is really very simple. You lose the right to complain about sluts with high notch counts if you participate in creating them. The exact same logic applies to littering. Everybody agrees a man who throws litter to the ground while complaining there’s too much litter on the ground is a joke.
I highly doubt any MGTOW is participating in any meaningful way to create sluts.
Depends on the definition of MGTOW. A man whose definition of MGTOW is not getting married or being in an LTR and who has many STR is a participant in the creation of sluts.
I think you’re confusing us with PUAs. Wrong website.
We’re talking about a specific topic now. I’m not confusing MGTOWs to PUAs.
<span style=”line-height: 1.5;”>I highly doubt anyone would go celibate for the reasons given, just as I highly doubt that any MGTOW is chasing pussy enough to significantly contribute to slut creation.
</span>
I’m not trying to convince anyone to do or not do anything. I just dislike the hypocrisy of hating sluts while thinking it’s ok to participate in creating them.
Also, let it be known that slut is a mentality of promiscuity, if she doesn’t f~~~ you, she’ll f~~~ someone else. This analogy with litter is not sufficient because litter doesn’t have a consciousness to litter itself.
So, your definition of a slut is a woman who wants to be promiscuous. I have a different definition based on actual promiscuity. The main difference here is the irreparable damage actual promiscuity causes a woman. The desire to be promiscuous is a stupid desire a woman might be able to be talked out of while a history of sluttish behavior cannot. According to my definition of slut, a woman cannot make herself a slut without assistance from men.
I agree with the OP, but i disagree at the scolding of MGTOW.. have you heard of WMGTOW wise men go their own way? Made famous by Clasik Obas on youtube
Anonymous18Indeed she’ll f~~~ someone else. But the scenario would be simple, that if all men went celibate then there would be no whores or sluts. They can’t exist if nobody is f~~~ing. Not realistic I know, but it is the ultimate way to defeat these women with there disgusting behaviour which is what the OP was trying to suggest
OK. Done. No woman to be f~~~ed by men here for next 2 years. The sexually frustrated women now flock to you for some c~~~. What you gonna do?
Fall in love and marry her because she is so righteous and dignified?
Is a virgin prude what you define as a NAWALT?
Indeed she’ll f~~~ someone else. But the scenario would be simple, that if all men went celibate then there would be no whores or sluts. They can’t exist if nobody is f~~~ing. Not realistic I know, but it is the ultimate way to defeat these women with there disgusting behaviour which is what the OP was trying to suggest
OK. Done. No woman to be f~~~ed by men here for next 2 years. The sexually frustrated women now flock to you for some c~~~. What you gonna do? Fall in love and marry her because she is so righteous and dignified? Is a virgin prude what you define as a NAWALT?
What am I going to do? Still not have sex with them. I couldn’t care less about having sex again.
As for marriage, I do believe in marriage but not what society defines as marriage. Marriage for me is simple, a man and woman get together and decide to raise a family. No certificates, no contracts, no need for a massive ceremony costing 1000’s of dollars. But I’ve no interest in getting married either because having children in this world is just a trap.
If the idea to be celibate is in the hope that all women will eventually come flocking to you, then you’re doing it for the wrong reason. But nature does intend for the women to make the first move, not the man. If all men simply didn’t bother pursuing women, women would pursue them. We already know women love to invade male spaces.
And to answer the last part of your message. Not being a whore doesn’t make a woman a prude. It’s amazing that we’ve got to this stage though. That a woman who isn’t whoring herself is a prude and then we complain when women act like whores. So what do we want? Women who act like whores, use men for resources and feed their children junk food and stick them in front of the TV all day. Or women who have respect for their bodies, obey men and actually feed their children healthy food and be a decent mother? A whore can never be a decent women, it’s a oxymoron. A woman who has f~~~ed around will hate herself, men for using her and even her own children. This is part of the reason why so many women are hateful.
- AuthorPosts
You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
921526
921524
919244
916783
915526
915524
915354
915129
914037
909862
908811
908810
908500
908465
908464
908300
907963
907895
907477
902002
901301
901106
901105
901104
901024
901017
900393
900392
900391
900390
899038
898980
896844
896798
896797
895983
895850
895848
893740
893036
891671
891670
891336
891017
890865
889894
889741
889058
888157
887960
887768
886321
886306
885519
884948
883951
881340
881339
880491
878671
878351
877678
