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This topic contains 26 replies, has 15 voices, and was last updated by 
Tim Patten 4 years, 4 months ago.
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I’m writing a ‘nice’ definition of MGTOW for Wikipedia so we are not bashed by haters like this definition: http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Men_Going_Their_Own_Way
Here is what I have: Please help criticize as needed. I apologize to those who do not want to define it, but left undefined others will define it for us…. This appeared at AV4m and NCFM.org. where feedback was used to improve the definition.
Men Going Their Own Way (MGTOW) is a worldwide phenomenon, based on a philosophy of gaining control over a man’s personal freedom and future. MGTOW is a lifestyle that frees men from patriarchal traditions regarding expectations for dating, entanglements and marriage. It liberates men from a life of tiresome labor, waste of personal resources, and constant emotional exhaustion devoted to toxic mates, girlfriends or wives. For many years, these ideas were limited to individuals and small communities. But today, the Internet has allowed these precepts to become easily available, and millions of men around the world are finding their way on the road to sovereignty.
MGTOW is sometimes referred to as “Taking the Red Pill”. Just as in The Matrix, the Red Pill enabled those who swallowed it to see the surprising reality behind conventional living and common sense. MGTOW is opening the eyes of ordinary men to a new, better set of possibilities after seeing the painful truth that men grow up in a hierarchical social order that imposes expectations and directives upon them. They are called to Man Up, which included taking on traditional work and marriage. It is a system that sees men pour out their best energies for a woman, children, or the social organism, only to see himself become irrelevant and cast aside once his prime years are spent.
MGTOW is a growing global awareness that helps men avoid dangerous relationships within a Gynocentric society, which exalts women’s physical and emotional needs over all others. Oftentimes, individuals discover the MGTOW message after a conventional relationship turns poisonous and causes them anger or pain.
Some, but not all MGTOW men, ascribe to these ideals:
A.Liberation from the Matriarchal rulebook of entanglements and dating
B.Avoidance of risks in marriage and co-habitation, and in its place value my own life on my terms
C.Rejection of role as sole provider, protector, or pack mule in relationships
D.Recognize financial reality of relationships today, and in the future
E.Avoid costs of raising children; veto God’s commandment to “go forth and multiply”
F.Defy societal male shaming techniques and slogansThe MGTOW population raises awareness about its mission, and allows every man to develop his own individual set of rules, whatever works best for him. Each MGTOW member cannot be casually labeled. This would result in an inaccurate and unfair characterization of discrete MGTOW member’s ideas, experience, knowledge, and unique background. MGTOW is a phenomenon that does not discriminate by age, ethnicity, political affiliation, or other irrelevant factors. There are millions across the world who value a life of individual acceptance and freedom.
This enlightened view of independence is mainly sustained by a brotherhood of men.MGTOW History:
Bachelorhood is nothing new, even Paul the Apostle observed that wives and family can be an encumbrance. The current wave: MGTOW may have been inspired by Japanese Herbivores , or “grass eaters”. These are men who avoid permanent marital and romantic relationships. The earliest reference to the tenets of MGTOW as an organized lifestyle was from a western newspaper entry in 1835 and Herbivore men, the term itself, was first coined by Maki Fukasawa in an article published on Oct. 13, 2006. MGTOW became a buzzword in 2008 and 2009.[7][8][9][10] MGTOW has spread throughout every major nation. Men are becoming increasingly aware of relationships’ risks, such as emotional, physical abuse and financial enslavement, due to the strictures of modern society’s gynocentric patriarchy.Around 2008, marital failures and relationship difficulties were being publicly shared on various social media sites, including YouTube. Anonymous men with pseudonyms like Stardusk, Sandman, and Barbarossa, were a few of the forward-thinking innovators of the MGTOW YouTube phenomenon. Their videos attracted interest, and their ideas quickly spread to others. Now YouTube has hundreds of videos offering a daily dose of the Red Pill.
MGTOW Education
Men have to seek out MGTOW education and community where they can find it. Without political movements or women’s studies to teach men, these ideas aren’t taught in schools, but it thrives on the Internet. It is a coalition of sharing that fuels connection and consciousness. Social media (Facebook, Reddit, YouTube, forums, etc.) allow the MGTOW population and interested parties to bond. Educated experiences and discoveries are distributed and refined. Websites devoted to this movement is http://www.MGTOW.com, Sheading the Ego (http://sheddingoftheego.com) and Happy Bachelors Forum (http://happybachelorsforum.com).Common Myths
Men’s Rights: Some people believe that MGTOW is an ideology that splintered off from Men’s Rights Advocacy (MRA). Previously, MGTOW may have been introduced through MRA connections. However, today most individuals discover the message through MGTOW social media channels and networks. Millions have found the MGTOW lifestyle, and some are not active political advocates for men’s rights and instead focus on flourishing within the existing society.Sexless: Some people claim MGTOW bans sex with women or it is a ‘strike’ that punishes women. A small group of MGTOW may be asexual, but most continue sexual relationships with women and have no interest in penalizing women.
Anti-Social: Others believe these men are hermits and want to move away from civilization. MGTOW are everywhere and live ordinary lives.
Hate: MGTOW is mistakenly considered a “rage against women” and “misogynistic.” But these men are actually discovering freedom, fulfillment of dreams, sex, and love, as they dodge the proverbial bullets of a culture that attempt to reinforce traditional dating and marriage contrivances. These men love women. Some MGTOW have suffered financial, physical and emotional pain in relationships, marriages, and divorces, only to find MGTOW for emotional support. They are given a safe place to vent.
Wind Society Backwards: Some think MGTOW is used to take society backwards, creating a society of marital ownership and oppression of women. Instead, MGTOW is moving the male society forward and cultivating quality relationships between the sexes. It creates an alternative future for men of all types and ages, and is a liberating force for young men, revealing a livable path before young men have suffered the blows of traditional masculine roles.
Gay, Cry Baby, or Sissy: The overwhelming majority of the MGTOW population is not gay. They date and enjoy women, but avoid any living arrangement that might douse their life ambitions and liberty. These individuals are not crying over previous injury, but are gaining power over their destiny. Each MGTOW individual creates his own path.
Looks pretty good to me. Thanks for the effort.
I personally think that a definition of MGTOW should limit itself to NO, Thank You but that might not be enough for Wikipedia.Don't let them Blame, Shame or Tame you!
Give 'em NOTHING, not even an answer!
#GenderSegragationNow!Looks good! A proper definition of a proper lifestyle!
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are you a chia pet in man drag Great synopsis! But the most important aspect of a Wikipedia page is sources. Don’t forget about those.
Just be a bit weary, there was a definition on there a few years back but it was deleted because the sources cited were mainly from Youtube or small websites. If you can get good sources to back up your facts, it will have less of a chance of being deleted. I suspect there was a certain level of Femnazi involvment in getting the original page removed because feminist students are encouraged to alter Wikipedia entries to suit their propoganda. The Gamergate page was eventually locked because feminists kept trying to re-write history.
EDIT: If anyone can post links to news articles that would back up MGTOW, and could be used as citation to back up the Wikipedia page, it would be a good idea to post them here.
The Sexodus:
I’m writing a ‘nice’ definition of MGTOW for Wikipedia so we are not bashed by haters like this definition: http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Men_Going_Their_Own_Way%5B/quote%5D
I was wondering when someone else would see that. I myself have changed it twice to: “Need non biased facts please.” or something like that.
Philosophy, the female repellent
Good afternoon Tim. Marvelous effort. But why are you doing a “nice” version?
Did someone get to you?
(I say this all as a friend in a “nice” way too)
What’s on our about page is “nice”. Nobody has ever pushed back on it. In fact, it has made it’s way to many youtube videos and urban dictionary as the example. Believe me when we tell you we spent more time writing that one paragraph than ANYTHING on this website. Those few sentences were the most difficult to write. But they say it all. ALL other terms and conditions are left to individual and that’s the beauty of it all.
MGTOW is the manifestation of one word “NO”. Common sense for men. A simple “No” is “nice” enough already – because at least it’s a response. It’s all you have to say to make the point. “No, sorry I can’t because” is the soft-ass version, and now you’re running around in circles – explaining and defining yourself – when “no” was all you needed to say. Whether or not it’s accepted by Urban Dictionary (or anyone) as the final answer is irrelevant. It is the answer. It is the final word.
Whether or not it is ACCEPTED as “the final word” is a different story.
MGTOW don’t really CARE if “no” as the final word is accepted.Why the need to editorialize? As soon as you do that, you get wordy like women. You start “explaining common misconceptions”. F~~~ that. That’s what feminists do. Explaining common misconceptions (or myths) is really ineffective. They say “MGTOW hate women” and only a moron gets suckered in to that conversation trying to explain that he doesn’t. I am guilty of that myself, but the only reason I engage in it, is to LAUGH IN THEIR FACES because you will never see a MGHOW spit in a woman’s face, knocking the Starbucks out of her hand, or start yelling at her out of out nowhere. MGTOW treat women better than they deserve. That is a goddam guarantee.
Strike everything that is not exclusive to MGTOW.
• “Hating women” is not exclusive to MGTOW because women do it too. If you want to talk about how MGTOW relates to “hate” you can make sure you mention that it’s a reaction to the blatant misandry in the culture.. There are 25 more pages of that. You will never see MGTOW tweet s~~~ like that. – ever. You haven’t even used the word “misandry” once – but you’re going to try to explain away “misogyny”????
WHY. That doesn’t make any sense.
If I didn’t know better, I might ask who’s side are you on?
• Being gay is also not exclusive to MGTOW.
• Being Anti social is not exclusive to MGTOW.
• Being sexless is not exclusive to MGTOW.
• A cry baby or sissy is not exclusive to MGTOW.So why are they even on the list? You’re also calling it a “movement” – instead of an “individual lifestyle choice”. Feminism is a movement. Gay pride is a movement. And they all depend on the success of a group to come together with funding, conferences, meetings, organized events, parades, shutting down traffic… but MGTOW succeeds simply because a population of individuals made an “individual lifestyle choice”. No movement required. NO parades. No taxpayer funding. No organized events. No marching. And MGTOW flourishes. That’s how you know it’s not a “movement”.
It’s an IDEA. And you can’t stop the marching of an idea.
Strike everything that is not exclusive to MGTOW.You don’t need to explain (or justify) something EVERYONE does and experiences.
Here is an outwardly attractive female who “can’t get laid” and she is singing about an entire population of them!!So only an idiot say “MGTOW are just a bunch of unattractive sexless guys who can’t get laid”.
It’s preposterous. Just put that music video on Wikipedia and your job is done!!!MGTOW have also been around much longer than “the japanese herbivores” cultural phenomenon. I believe I posted direct inprint references to articles from 1850 using the exact words “Men Going Their Own Way'”. Go back to 1865 with Schopenhauer. Go back 600 years to Galieo. Tesla, Hell, you can go as far back as Jesus if you want. You have to edit the MGTOW History because 2006 is totally inaccurate. Or at least adjust it. MGTOW is MGTOW man. It didn’t originate from anywhere but a man’s sleeping giant awakening from within. You can read it in HUNDREDS of introductions here. HUNDREDS. “I had no idea such a thing existed – or that it had a name”. It didn’t come from the herbivores in japan. It didn’t come from the internet. It came from within HIMSELF and he found us AFTER THE FACT.
Tim. As much as I love you as a kindred spirit …. it’s time to stop looking for a “nice” way to say “no”.
Just …… “no”.
What you DON’T say…. is equally as important as what you DO say.
“Good design is not when there is nothing left to add…. but when there is nothing left to take away” – Steve JobsNOT saying it is why MGTOW works.
Hell I would even be tempted to write THE WIKIPEDIA DEFINITION OF MGTOW: “The sound of one hand clapping.”.
Take from it what you will. And thanks for your effort.
If you keep doing what you've always done... you're gonna keep getting what you always got.Well, when was that put up? It has been edited to hell, and now has slamming of MGTOW in it, in the document. Like, take this bit:
Power?
It’s unclear if the movement has any power beyond “disgruntled douchebags talking s~~~ about women on the Internet.” As a general rule, the reaction of sane people is “Go your own way and stop whining already!”GTOW
The “going their own way” part is often framed not just as manly self-preservation but as a “strike” that is supposed to punish women. In the worldview of all too many MGTOWers, women are succubi-like creatures, who seduce men in order to exploit them, but are unable to live support themselves without men to exploit. (It’s worth mentioning that there’s a strong whiff of overt misogyny wafting around many in the movement.) There are amusing parallels here with the notion of “going Galt” that is popular among libertarians who overestimate their importance in the grand scheme of things. It’s perhaps telling that despite professing to ‘go their own way’ they seem utterly incapable of stopping talking about women in their internet fora.You aren’t going to get anything useful in there at all. Anything put in positive, will be made neutral (AT BEST), if not turned totally mocking in sections.
At least it has links to various websites in it.
I tell you, this isn’t going to end well. This is better off going into Encyclopedia Dramatica realm.
"I am my own thang. Any questions?" - Davis S Pumpkins.
Actually, that is NOT Wikipedia. Wikipedia is its own thing. That site is its own thing that will have its own biases. That is a step up from Encyclopedia Dramatica.
"I am my own thang. Any questions?" - Davis S Pumpkins.
Interesting topic. After kicking this around for 5 minutes, this is how I see Mgtow-
Mgtow is an idea. Mgtow is about an individual’s choice to be free.
Mgtow’s are involved with individuals who add to their lives and are independent of those who would take from their lives.
Mgtow’s seek freedom from bad relationships. Mgtow’s are wary of female manipulation and entitlement.
Freedom is the opportunity to live your life the way you want to live it.
In search of freedom, Mgtow’s choose to live their lives independent of female manipulation and entitlement. They are detached from entitled and manipulative females, and as a result have more time and resources to pursue other interests. This is how I see Mgtow.
Thank you gentlemen.I’ve made changes per everyone feedback. The Wikipedia page has many references to resources in hopes that they keep the definition up.
I’ve made changes per everyone feedback. The Wikipedia page has many references to resources in hopes that they keep the definition up.
Citing sources should weaken the femnazi’s attempts to take down the page. The only other thing that i would add is don’t be afraid to add some critisims of MGTOW also, eg, the Huffington Post article on MGTOW involving Sandman. I know that it sounds counter productive, but it adds balance to the prespective. We’re not feminists who try to control what people think so we should strive to be better than them. The worst we can be acused of is being mysoginists, but that means f~~~ all in these modern times.
There is NO WAY to be able edit the page at all. You will get a warning if you try to fix the page on there. So, don’t even bother to do anything. MAYBE you can do real wikipedia page, and not the page there. That site has an agenda, trying to push rationalism as an ideology, at the expense of everything else, and throwing out attempts to be non-bias when the participants see things that scream “no sane human would think that”.
Read the story of the opinions regarding that page here, and see why it is pointless:
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Talk:Men_Going_Their_Own_WaySo, look over that an go elsewhere. Don’t waste your time with that site at all. Maybe when the rationalwiki folks care to be more rational, you can get somewhere.
"I am my own thang. Any questions?" - Davis S Pumpkins.
Anonymous29Good afternoon Tim. Marvelous effort. But why are you doing a “nice” version? Did someone get to you?
Link below is one of a few but this one will shed some light on Tim. Look into comments of Sandmans vid
Doing research on MGTOW for next book ?Oh I would never place stock in what anyone else has to say about Tim. Only my direct interaction with him. Especially “Sandman”. He that’s talking doll with a pull-string on his back. You shove a dime in his mouth, pull the string and he says:
“Thanks for taking your daily dose of red pills…. aaaaaaaaand….. cheeeerzzzzzzz”.
He’s the MacDonald’s Hamburger of MGTOW.
You know exactly what it’s gonna taste like before you bite into it.I responded to Tim purely based on what he said right here.
One major difference between Tim and Sandman is …. TIM responded to all of our emails in a timely manner. So who cares what others have to say when Tim will say it himself.. Sandman never once reached out to us. Tim actually has the integrity to show up here, go out of his way and ASK for criticism. I will tip my hat to him any day.
If you keep doing what you've always done... you're gonna keep getting what you always got.It looks pretty good but there are certain improvements that could be made. An extension of MGTOW History and a combination of Myths could improve the look greatly. There is also a need for a large number of sources to back in order to back the definition, maybe some of the videos that bar bar has made.
A MGTOW is a man who is not a woman's bitch!
Should add a small section labeled:
“Notable Phrases”And just put 1 entry:
“No”😛
My Goal: To Leave Society.
Btw, started up talk:mgtow
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:MGTOW
Please leave a comment towards getting wiki to allow the creation of a MGTOW page. ~~~~ to leave a signature.
My Goal: To Leave Society.
Btw, started up talk:mgtow
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:MGTOW
Please leave a comment towards getting wiki to allow the creation of a MGTOW page. ~~~~ to leave a signature.Hopefully that gets an entry so no one goes to the RationalWiki page.
"I am my own thang. Any questions?" - Davis S Pumpkins.
Anonymous29Oh I would never place stock in what anyone else has to say about Tim. Only my direct interaction with him. Especially “Sandman”. He that’s talking doll with a pull-string on his back. You shove a dime in his mouth, pull the string and he says:
Yes I know, he had gone all commercial on us ages ago. In a rush that link was the only one I could remember where Tim made comments.
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