This topic contains 39 replies, has 24 voices, and was last updated by 
Won'tGetFooledAgain 4 years ago.
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I’m 25 and from a very young age I questioned why women were treated better than men. As a young boy growing up I saw the inherent misandry with teachers at school(male or female) and was skeptical of male/female relations in humans since then. When I was 12 and girls were developing physically many would ask for money from boys using flirtation as a tactic. Some would use their sex appeal to have the smartest boys do their homework, of course, none of these poor souls ever got laid. Instead the wannabe thugs and athletes did the majority of smashing. When puberty improved my shoulder to waist ratio and shot my height above the national average I realized scoring wasn’t as difficult either especially since by pure luck I developed a rather poor attitude for people due to constant fighting with said wannabe thugs and dealing with teachers.
Years later I look at how women respond to men, my friends, family, strangers at work, IRL and online and I realize that the average woman doesn’t seem to care about the average man too much. It seems that outside of competing in materialistic clit measuring contests with other women; that the main opinion the average woman is concerned about is a small segment of men in society. You know the rich, famous and extremely genetically gifted of our gender. It seems that if you don’t have a substantial amount of any of these qualities your sex life will consist of a lot of effort/grinding. Now every man has to grind with women even the ones with money contrary to popular belief. This isn’t the 50s anymore, even the best of us must use some kind of effort with women past high school.
The problem is, as it is effort will go a long way if you’re extremely genetically gifted but not very far if you’re more average. I’ve seen average guys on the street approach women and strike out consistently, they have to invest a considerable amount of effort and time for a lay. Fat guys who get hot girls pay out the ass to attract and keep said girls usually knowing someone else has or will smash with considerably less effort. Personality and social skills are quite overrated with women these days since it takes massive effort IRL or online to even get a chick to agree to hang out with you 1v1.
I hear of the tactic of ignoring women to make yourself more attractive but it’s completely useless if you have nothing of value that she wants. If you’re not rich, well off, popular or very good looking then you disappearing means nothing since as an average guy she has more of you available which leads me to the problem.
There’s too many of us. I make no distinction between manginas, WKs, PUAs, MRAs and us MGTOW there’s just too much average man to go around and it has devalued us immensely. Now I’m of the belief that in terms of general existence most men have more usefulness, talent and insight in their armpit hair than most women in their entire bodies but we’re talking strictly sexual value here sadly. The standard for men keeps rising while women’s standards keep falling. We’re at a point now where men have to be the rich, athletic, powerful, aggressive, intelligent superhuman, demigod offspring of Zeus, superman and Goku to even maintain a woman’s attention while the above average man has to settle for chunky, out of shape, chain smoking, unaware, dumb, boring, bland, no fashion sense semi dyke filth from tumblr.
Women can only value men when there’s less of us to go around, there’s a reason why myspace, okc and tinder was so a goldmine early on because less men were available, once things even out, men have to work harder and once more men show up than women, then things become near impossible. It’s what happened to night game years ago and it’s happening to online and it’ll keep happening until things in the environment get bad enough that women need men directly again or most men get killed off somehow.
I can’t tell you to give up, I can’t tell another man to stop dealing with women though a lot of you have and will because it isn’t my place. I’m just saying that for all the younger men like myself who continue to try to get laid, we’re in for a rough one. I’m probably not saying anything new at all and if I’m cluttering the forum then I apologize but I just want to invite some discussion and maybe we could find some solutions that I haven’t considered.
For sure I am not telling any man here the tired nonsense of self improvement for the sake of appeasing women to get laid. We’ve all heard that garbage and it only helps to reinforce the problems we’re facing now. I personally enjoy physical activity and getting smarter for the sake of it, if it gets me some booty thats great but whether I go dry for the next 20 years or drown in vag I’ll do it regardless. And I’d hope many of you think the same, do what makes you happiest since that’s the point of MGTOW if I’m not mistaken.
There’s too many of us. I make no distinction between manginas, WKs, PUAs, MRAs and us MGTOW
really ? are you sure you want to be here …? your pretty cat avatar has me unsure if there’s a difference between you and a lady..
25 is not an easy age for dating.
Hone your skill set. Time is on your side. For LAYDEEZ, time is a two deaths sentence."It seems like there's times a body gets struck down so low, there ain't a power on earth that can ever bring him up again. Seems like something inside dies so he don't even want to get up again. But he does."
really ? are you sure you want to be here …? your pretty cat avatar has me unsure if there’s a difference between you and a lady..
Misunderstood there buddy, in this context I make no distinction when it comes to any of us trying to get laid not in general. If you can’t see the difference you have a smaller mind than you think and tigers are far more than just pretty cats dawgies they’re apex predators. I’m sure I want to be here. I’ve never paid for a date or given a female any money besides my mother. Any sex I’ve gotten game at the expense of time and energy and not cash.
Once again, it doesn’t matter if you’re MGTOW or some beta mangina to women, as long as so many of us crowd online dating apps, as long as there’s a ton of men in the work place hitting on chicks, as long as men as a whole hit on chicks for any reason we’re all part of the problem and devaluing each other. Now if you disagree use your big boy words and explain why. You’re salty response has me unsure of the difference between you and a lady.
really ? are you sure you want to be here …? your pretty cat avatar has me unsure if there’s a difference between you and a lady..
Misunderstood there buddy, in this context I make no distinction when it comes to any of us trying to get laid not in general. If you can’t see the difference you have a smaller mind than you think and tigers are far more than just pretty cats dawgies they’re apex predators. I’m sure I want to be here. I’ve never paid for a date or given a female any money besides my mother. Any sex I’ve gotten game at the expense of time and energy and not cash.
Once again, it doesn’t matter if you’re MGTOW or some beta mangina to women, as long as so many of us crowd online dating apps, as long as there’s a ton of men in the work place hitting on chicks, as long as men as a whole hit on chicks for any reason we’re all part of the problem and devaluing each other. Now if you disagree use your big boy words and explain why. You’re salty response has me unsure of the difference between you and a lady.
You sure you wanna be here? The fact you made that statement means you don’t get the point of being MGTOW.
With your “logic”, there is no difference between an alpha and a beta when it comes to getting laid.
are you a chia pet in man drag Possible tuna alert!
"You can either love women or understand them, you can't do both". Truth over everything
You sure you wanna be here? The fact you made that statement means you don’t get the point of being MGTOW.
I don’t want to be here if supposed enlightened and intelligent men keep missing the point. I’ll say it once more and hopefully you understand. To women as a whole right now, in 2016 it is completely irrelevant what kind of men are hitting on here. The sheer fact that women have access to so much male attention devalues all of us by default. Even if you’re MGTOW, when you’re dealing with a woman you’re in a much lower position because you’re easily disposable. This has always been true for a while but it’s getting worse with more men saturating avenues to meet women. My entire point is, the standard for men is going up and I don’t think it’s in line with the MGTOW philosophy to desperate try to “level up” for access to more poon. I’m simply raising the concern that those of us MGTOW who still choose to try to bed women may be feeding into the problem.
I’m not saying that I don’t see a difference in MGTOW men and how we handle women, I’m saying that MGTOW are not, whether you get laid or not you’re unintentionally adding to the oversaturation of the sexual market and that is raising the difficulty of getting laid in general.
With your “logic”, there is no difference between an alpha and a beta when it comes to getting laid.
Lol you really use these absurd distinctions? Alpha and beta are not static things, most men have traits that fall in either category and can be either one at any point in time and in any social interaction. Let me humor this dichotomy then, with the amount of men trying to solicit sex or companionship from women nowadays it will be increasingly difficult to appear as “alpha” to women.
Besides most of us are average by default, wouldn’t that make the majority of us here beta anyways? I don’t think being MGTOW automatically makes one alpha.
Struggling to get laid like women want us to be doing is not good for you in the long-term.
All of the last of the women I have dated and had sex with I met on chat sites. Until it finally dawned on me that all of these women are a hassle and a hazard. .That was long after a divorce from which I deeply regret having gotten married .
Sooner or later you figure out that just because a woman is not a lesbian does not mean she has any empathy or compassion for men.Most women have no empathy for men at all.. If you can stomach the RedPill at all.frankly my dear i don't give a damn
@mgtowwave – I don’t disagree that’s the entire point of this topic, I’m not trying to convince men here to give up on women but based on observation and the statistics for online dating and the impact of smartphones in general. I think the average guy is better off not bothering with dating. Unless you’re some kind of top tier dude who finds getting laid extremely easy most MGTOW and men in general are probably better off giving up on women entirely.
If people want to persist that’s fine but I think it’s mostly a futile exercise. It takes a lot of time and energy especially if money isn’t involved and there’s the risk of a salty chick trying to make life more difficult.
Welcome to the forums mate;)
Seems that you’ve made a lot of thoughts on this matter, which is good… one can learn a lot just by putting things in perspective. Yet there is one thing I could sense from most of what was written in your post, one thing that seemed to linger in the back of every sentence. And that thing is hope, a hope that sometime in the future the dynamics between men and women will change for the better:
I just want to invite some discussion and maybe we could find some solutions that I haven’t considered.
One of the main things that separate MGTOW from all the other groups in the Manosphere, is that we have accepted that there is no hope. Rather, we see women for what they really are, based on common sense and proven research. Feminism has been taken so far, that nothing can be reversed to what it used to be, like traditionalism for instance.
Yet it seems you have gotten a good view of how the two genders relate to one another. Much of what I say is probably something you have an opinion about already. But if you are a man of 25 years, there is plenty of ways to get laid. One thing is for certain, that women everywhere have never been easier to seduce than today. They have forgotten the value their sexuality once had on the sexual marked, and so they spread their legs to any man who is able to give her good feelings and experiences. This is something you could use to your advantage, if all you seek is a ONS.
Hope this helps,
Cheers!The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal - Aristotle (384 - 322 BC)
My entire point is, the standard for men is going up and I don’t think it’s in line with the MGTOW philosophy to desperate try to “level up” for access to more poon.
Going your own way is not a result of the inability to get women. All the guys on this forum already possess the attributes of the very highest standard.
I dont know if this guy is a mangina or a woman undercover but this posts raised a lot of red screaming flags in my mind.
@einherjar – Oh I have absolutely no hope in men and women ever getting along nor do I hope for some BS bygone era of traditionalism. I don’t want to be a husband, a bf or even a consistent FWB. I can only tolerate women in very small doses, I find their inane babble extremely irritating and it takes extreme self control for me not to spaz on them. I’ve walked away from tons of girls or kicked them out because I’ve lost patience with them and I want to avoid going to jail for smacking someone’s daughter.
When the economy collapses women will be skulking back to men on their hands and knees looking for provision once the government can no longer fund their slutitude and I won’t be one of the happy men welcoming them back. This whole topic is defeatist, whether I continue to get laid consistently isn’t important, what is important is men as a whole. Everytime myself or my friend gets laid we’ve just done men a disservice and we’re continuing the derpy cycle. We’re competing with other men, other MGTOW, cutting them down to boost ourselves up and the woman benefits entirely. Even though I spend at most metrocard fare and snacks when I’m hungry for myself. The time and energy invested in banging some chick can’t come back. Whether any of us bangs or not, interacting with these chicks gives them more experience and makes her more of a douche to other guys which includes our MGTOW bretheren.
MGTOW is not in any way a frustration or inability to get women. The guys going their own way actually have more alpha characteristics than those who aren’t.
Never said it was, so no need to get defensive. I’d say MGTOW guys are a lot more intelligent than other groups of men but more alpha is a stretch. Very very very few men are “truly” alpha in a lot of aspects, that’s not a knock on anyone’s character. You can be a decent human being without being considered alpha.
I dont know if this guy is a mangina or a woman undercover but this posts raised a lot of red screaming flags in my mind.
Right because I’m advocating that everyone here get married right now and pay for every date and that we should totally go protest with the feminazis at the nearest college campus. Dude get a grip, it seems like you’re projecting some kind of strawman onto me instead of discussing my actual post.
Its only because your actual post is treating everyone like that’s new s~~~ we’ve never heard of. Your subsequent ones treat us as if we are just desperate for pussy as a blue pill mangina, which, you say there no difference in a woman’s eyes. This is a MGTOW forum, not some pua one.
It doesn’t matter what women think, and nobody here cares.
are you a chia pet in man drag @jackinov – Funny you say that, some of you are so defensive that it seems more like a PUA forum than a MGTOW forum. It’s like some posters in here feel as if I’m shaming them/questioning their manhood when I’m not. Oh well I’ll adjust my expectations accordingly, can’t expect every MGTOW to be a carbon copy of Barbarossa/Stardusk/TFM etc.
There are specific traits MGTOW, puas, bluepills, manginas, and women have. You might not be a carbon copy, but you phrased s~~~ right off the bat as if we gave a damn what women thought about us.
are you a chia pet in man drag I respectfully disagree, if you’re trying to get laid at all. On some level you give a damn, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that and I’ll assume men on this site don’t use the same simpy, weenie tactics that the basic man uses.
I’m simply making the observation that the over saturation of men on social media which does include some of us is slowly but surely making it harder for all of us when it comes to the whole sex thing on our own terms. Even if it doesn’t affect you personally I was hoping to discuss long term effects, possible solutions etc.
So put your pitchfork down, stop being so defensive and cool it on the whole alphatude thing.
Schemescape the amount of responses to your own topic as well as the language and phrasing suggests to me you are TUNA.
"You can either love women or understand them, you can't do both". Truth over everything
I’ve read this thread, and re-read it just now.
Men, chill for a second. Schemescape, you came in really hard and wound up defending yourself from the get go.
As I understand your thinking, the plethora of available men who try to f~~~ them (even MGTOWs) makes women feel that they are more valuable than they actually are. That’s probably true for those that still want to engage with women on any social or fun level.
The problem as I see it is that you are new and came in here made a statement and then attempted a mic drop.
There is a full spectrum of responses to GYOW. Some of the guys here will only ever FWB. Some will date until she throws enough red flags. Some are already monk,and they are only here to save lives of new MGTOWs who still have a future Ex-wife holding a noose around their neck and b~~~~.
All of the negative response was due to your walking in and flopping your dick out.
Understand, I’m one of the first here to say you’re a man. You’re just new, and that provokes response from people here.
Over half of your first post talks about the premise behind women’s motivations… Hypergamy.
I’m almost twice as old as you are, and I could bag chicks your age all day if I wanted. The biggest problem is that they are all as stupid as they are cute, and they’d have Daddy issues or think I was going to support them for longer than it takes me to blow my load. Your experience up until now has been a small window into their nature, but coming in here and acting like you know all the secrets to the Universe is where the disconnect occurred.
Welcome brother. I get you, you might have just come on too strong.
I failed to realize in my youth that I was the prize. I was going to work. I was going to earn. Little did I realize that due to feminism, that no longer meant I had to share. Road soon, Desert after.
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