Is it wrong to throw in the towel here…?

[RebalancedParticipant 346]

Would appreciate some words of support/advice re: my court situation (due again in court tomorrow) vs my ex who is nigerian (would appreciate fermats angle on that part especially) and the epitome of a vindictive bitch

After 4 yrs back and forth to the family courts re: contact with my kids, this week I got a prohibitive steps order against my ex who was seeking to take my kids out of the country but was refusing to disclose where they were going. She was ordered repeatedly by the courts but kept refusing to give the details until this week she had her passport seized by order of the high courts.

Of course she has blamed me and my solicitor for her actions and has now made a whole heap of fresh allegations with the help of her friend in social services who can be proven to be lying by her other reports and documented court papers etc. My ex has also now said (again) that my kids don’t want to see me, although since last seeing them ( 2 weeks ago) she wrote in a statement that they enjoy seeing me one day on alternate weekends. Clearly they have been told that I stopped their holiday although it was their mothers actions to blame alone.

In light of the above and the fact that the judge is to be asked upon the recommendation of cafcass (like social services) to consider putting me on a DV course although there is no history of DV whatsoever from me to her and I have not been with her for 5 years (in fact I was identified as being at very high risk from her by the Police) do you think its wrong for me to throw in the towel and just wait till the kids are older?

 

 

 

 

I don't need pussy

[Anonymous 1]

Holy s…!

Dude, I don’t know what to say, except this: if you do throw the towel, I, for one, would understand. I am not married, neither I have any kids, and stories like yours is what made me change my mind on that regard.

I am hoping someone have more solid advice for you, but I would like to give you some support.

Good luck my friend

[ILiveAgainParticipant]

This is such a hard decision because you’re screwed if you do or don’t.

My case was sort of similar and I ended up in the high court after my ex abducted my daughter.

Hight court ordered Tipstaff to go get her.

If you throw the towel, will she up and go? That could be the end of your kids. Can you live with that?

If you fight you may fail and the we have the above result.

You may win and all will be good … sort of. She will still be a bitch … but one that has now lost. She is bound to still mess with you.

How old are your kids? This will gave a big impact. Can you string the legal s~~~ out until they are of age?

I so feel for you. It’s bring back bad memories.

[SteveParticipant 462]

I can’t give you any advice but I can offer you support.

I’m at the start of your path now and won’t say too much but have a wife and son from overseas and always hoped to get custody when he is a little older.

But recently for the past month or so have been thinking about throwing in the towel too and letting her have him. Partly because the fight would be very messy and damaging for everyone and partly because I secretly think (blue pill?) that she’s better at caring and “being a mother” than me. He see’s me as rough playtime and outdoors time, he always runs to his mum if he hurts himself or gets scared etc.

I’m sorry to hear of you situation, it must be very very draining for you and your kids. It might be a very s~~~ty thing to do but if you let them go now you could work on improving yourself and your own life and then make up for it when they are older? Your wife will say all sorts of lies and allegations and probably encouraged to do so by social services.

Hopefully some more experienced guys will be able to advise. Keep posting on here, I’ll keep checking.

Good luck at court tomorrow.

[SteveParticipant 462]

Something I researched also.

The Hague Convention.

Basically some countries signed up to it so that if a child is abducted and taken overseas without permission they can be brought back to place of birth.

My wife’s country haven’t signed up to it so I have had no choice but to hide his passport.

 

 

[RebalancedParticipant 346]

Thanks Badkan, I appreciate that.

Thanks also Iliveagain, it was tipstaff who went and seized the passports in this case too.

Its yet to be seen whether their passports are released tomorrow. The accusations have been thrown in at this point as a diversion tactic I’m sure. What irks me the most is that I rang CAFCASS and told them they have made recommendations without my input and that there info is provably wrong (offering them the same, they declined at this point). They have made amendments to their initial report last week wherein it was clearly stated that my ex was guilty of physical abuse to the children and went on a course for this. Today the report says that info should be disregarded and is full of so many provably false statements and recommends no contact until yet another S7 (wishes and feelings) report is made (although another cafcass worker said just 2 weeks ago in a report there have been enough s7 & s37 reports done already). When continually faced with corrupt social workers who rarely get punished for their lies even when proved in court, it makes it seem its time to give up. They are basically rehashing old allegations that my ex withdrew after trial and on the basis of which the judge ruled that there was no findings and no admissions made (a positive I would have thought).

There have been court dates repeatedly unattended and pushed back due to my ex’s non attendance and I feel even if a court order is again made it will again be breached. My kids are 10 and 6 yrs old so after 4 yrs I’m not sure how much longer it can be strung out

 

 

 

 

 

 

I don't need pussy

[RebalancedParticipant 346]

Appreciate the words Progenitor, throwing in the towel is not something easy to do but at least it would allow for some closure for now I guess and stop this escalating into something worse. I’ve held my patience for a long time but am not sure how much longer I can hold on before I snap otherwise, either imploding or exploding and possibly getting into legal trouble.

I wish you all the best if you do decide to try and get your son likewise.

I don't need pussy

[SteveParticipant 462]

I think your wife and the system is planning on making you snap one way or another. Don’t let them.

Just be careful with your own mental state. A stable happy functioning Dad is worth a lot more than, well you know.

Hopefully you can talk to someone about how you are doing in real life too. Maybe even a counsellor just to help keep you strong and focused.

 

[ILiveAgainParticipant]

Let me tell you how it played out for me.

My ex also missed court dates. Stopped court ordered contacts.

Cafcass were on her side all the time. My ex started thinking that everone was for her … and she was right to a point.

However, I started pointing out that she was in actual fact … being in contempt of court …. as was laughing at the crown while being abetted by the very same.

The judge ‘eventually’ attached power of arrest to all broken orders and that the point where my ex ran away.

So it might be that if you can manage to drag this out ….. she might snap.

I also represented myself and knew my case inside out.

They can’t do that. They have other side to deal with.

Also they have to send you everything and in good time for you to represent.

By doing this you are also bound to ask the court for guidence. This puts the judge on a much more even keel. This is because as a lay person, the court must guide you on legality but must also put in ‘normal speak’.

You could do all this and keep kicking down the road until she snaps or kids are of age.

[On the PathParticipant 28]

My brother has a 5 year old girl, divorced from the mother who is contiously making his life a hell.
He goes to court every other month to fight for his little girl.

But he’s getting tired. It is mentally and physically exausting dealing with this level of stress.
Do not think you’re a bad person to throw in the towel.
Fight for your kids to the point it becomes unbearable, than stop fighting without regrets.

The men here understand. Do what you can, and do the amount You can live with.

[BestoftherestParticipant 285]

This is sickening, is their no accountability for that agency?

"Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power."
Abraham Lincoln

[RebalancedParticipant 346]

Thank you all for all the support.

I am hoping that a power of arrest (penal notice) gets attached to the court order, I have a barrister in court for tomorrow (legal aid) but if he isn’t doing what I feel he should I think I will ask for him to be relieved and speak for myself. Like Iliveagain knew his case better, I feel I know my case better so may just go that avenue if the barristers speech doesn’t go according to plan. Having said that, my ex said to a judge who recently retired, you will have to put me in prison because I wont comply (was in 2011) and when my solicitor asked for that to happen he said: ‘I could but it might cause the children distress’ so I wonder if that (penal notice) would even work in the long run.

The thing with CAFCASS and Social Services is that they are court appointed (in effect employed by the court) so when you complain about them through official channels they generally cover each others backs. That has to be addressed by yourself (no solicitors) so doesn’t generally get far either.

I’d happily take my case to the newspapers and put them on front street if it would help and they (newspapers) would listen, its not like they are not regularly in the news already.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I don't need pussy

[ILiveAgainParticipant]

Family courts are secret courts …. best interest of the child crap.

Any news media will be in contempt if they publish.

It’s a beautiful system don’t you think.

[RebalancedParticipant 346]

I did think in some cases at least naming and shaming social workers could be done as long as children weren’t named, for e.g:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/10289806/Judge-rejects-ban-on-naming-and-shaming-social-workers.html

But either way I agree its a f’ng terrible system we have here.

In business there is an unwritten rule, being ‘cyclical redundancy’, in  other words, give a substandard product/service that will ensure customers need to come back and pay again and again, the court is a mighty fine example of that.

I don't need pussy

[ILiveAgainParticipant]

Just take some time and think about yourself 9k.

You can help some of the stress by working out or doing some hard physical work.

Remember … this IS a fight .. so train for it in mind body and spirit.

Peace

[Anonymous 13]

mghowtillidie@yahoo.com is my alternative temp email I can give out – if you need to talk.  I’m going through hell trying to get my kids back and some rights as a parent back again.  Its wrong how the courts treat fathers.  At an AA meeting some older women speak and it makes me cringe – hearing how they are / were and hearing how other men got f~~~ed over by the courts and babies mom – we need to share court findings and information – even though its different states – the government has some mandated mothers rights BS they made states adapt or they would be denied federal assistance, government loans and grants, that and they’d look terrible in the news as sexist evil states.  They were pushed in a VAWA bill, and all a women needs is a half wit lawyer and the ability to be a conniving lying bitch – and you’ve basically lost your parental rights.

 

We need to take a stand together and not put up with this!  Share info between cases in different states – it could help.  JUST DON’T GIVE UP, it will screw us all over, and your kids.  (sorry to be so blunt)  They want to put fathers in this imaginary place, in their place, a made up place for a make believe world that they are trying to create.  Where kids are raised only by the village, mom, and the government.  Where men are bulls – incapable of loving and caring for a child – only good for fertilizer and cannon fodder.  What a backwards world.  I love my kids and will not give up, most people know the truth, that fathers raise wealthier more successful kids, more disciplined, more moral, more able.

 

Sorry, you are in my thoughts.

[RebalancedParticipant 346]

Good idea Iliveagain, I’m planning to hit the weights tomorrow after court, have been too stressed of late and the endorphim rush would definitely help i think.

@ Utopian, sorry to hear you are going through the same thing, will email you tomorrow when I know a bit more about the situation after court (its nearly midnight here too and the sleeping pill is going to kick in very soon), thanks for reaching out, hope I can help you in turn.  I agree with what you said we definitely need to continue to share info and get it out there in the one place where censorship doesn’t really exist (internet) at least.

I don't need pussy

[FermatParticipant 3478]

@rebalanced

I have read your predicament. My analysis is as follows:

Would appreciate some words of support/advice re: my court situation (due again in court tomorrow) vs my ex who is nigerian (would appreciate fermats angle on that part especially) and the epitome of a vindictive bitch.

Nigerians in general, are extremely intelligent and extremely shrewd. They are famous for the 419 scams for a reason. This is not racist or prejudice, it is equivocal fact on par with the theory of gravity. When you marry the women, but don’t live in Nigeria, they will feign submission to you until you give them a child. Then they will turn on you and throw their nonsense “traditional” values out the window. It happens over and over and over again. My father’s friend is going through this: the man is a young guy working a crap job while his wife will not work, cannot drive, pawned off his wedding ring., accuses him of trying to kill her and dumb her in a body bag, and refuses to let him touch her child. This couple visits my parents very often and the same fights and arguments go down. You should know by now how Nigerians like to shout and fight, because of their stupid ego. The irony: my parents are going through the same thing: my mother submitted and let my dad be the leader of the family, then get lazy once we turned 18 and stopped caring about our well-being and respecting my dad. He is livid, my mom thinks he does not “look after her needs” even though he’s been busting his rear end as an entrepreneur while she is happy in her routine job as a nurse. Nigerian women will boast how Nigeria has a low divorce rate and claim the women are “so submissive” and “traditional”. This a lie to the nth degree: it’s because women in general have nothing to gain from the government in Nigeria if they divorce, so they are stuck. Female nature is invariant regardless of where you go, it’s just the law to repress that nature varies. I’m sure you have learned this.

After 4 yrs back and forth to the family courts re: contact with my kids, this week I got a prohibitive steps order against my ex who was seeking to take my kids out of the country but was refusing to disclose where they were going.

She is likely going to take them back to Nigeria. Where else can she go? If not, likely where other family is located. Nigerians operate in communities, especially the women. They cannot function on their own. Their egos and nonsense “traditional family” values prevent them from being completely independent. My dad’s friend who I mentioned earlier, the crazy wife took their child from him and ran to a homeless shelter to cry crocodile tears of DV, abuse, child endangerment, you name it. There the women there helped her cook up a story for court, so the husband will be royally screwed. Notice how she did not go into isolation: they go for HELP. Are you in touch with your wife’s family in your country or in Nigeria? If not, pick up a calling card TODAY and contact them, and inform them of how your wife is behaving. Knowing how her family operates will give you a better idea on where she may be headed with the child.

She was ordered repeatedly by the courts but kept refusing to give the details until this week she had her passport seized by order of the high courts. Of course she has blamed me and my solicitor for her actions and has now made a whole heap of fresh allegations with the help of her friend in social services who can be proven to be lying by her other reports and documented court papers etc.

She dodged and failed. Nigerian women have a nasty habit of giving you the silent treatment and think that if they play invisible, no one will bother them. Childish. When relatives from Nigeria call, my mother will never want to talk to them. She will only talk to them if they need money, so she can bother my father to give money to her family. However, she will not give money to his. Money is #1 reason to NEVER deal with Nigerians. I love my heritage, but marriage, business, anything involving money with them ALWAYS goes sour. You don’t need to wonder why the country is in a mess.

My ex has also now said (again) that my kids don’t want to see me, although since last seeing them ( 2 weeks ago) she wrote in a statement that they enjoy seeing me one day on alternate weekends. Clearly they have been told that I stopped their holiday although it was their mothers actions to blame alone.

Classic female move. Using kids to destroy your self esteem when they realize their BS doesn’t work. My mother and father have a nasty habit of summoning my siblings and I requesting we pick sides, in an effort to shame each other. I have lived this the past 10 years. I completely understand what you have had to deal with.

In light of the above and the fact that the judge is to be asked upon the recommendation of cafcass (like social services) to consider putting me on a DV course although there is no history of DV whatsoever from me to her and I have not been with her for 5 years (in fact I was identified as being at very high risk from her by the Police) do you think its wrong for me to throw in the towel and just wait till the kids are older?

I might be the only one on this forum to say this, but DO NOT GIVE UP. Not yet. I am in the US so I may not familiar with your country’s laws, but I will say she is counting on you giving up. Her bluff is threatening to leave the country, assuming you won’t chase her. If she leaves back to Nigeria, she will have had to already convince her family you are at fault, so she will not be shamed. The culture greatly frowns on divorce, so I suggest you get in touch with her relatives if you haven’t already to see if they know her plans. Nigerians are like birds: they like to chat among one another. Do not wait until the kids are older, and here’s why. She will, without a doubt, raise the kids on nonsense Nigerian values of marriage and brainwash them. This almost happened to me. Nigerian men will chase vagina like animals because we are raised to be virgins until 35. At that point, they are so horny they ignore the red flags and are drunk on monkey love cause “God has brought them their queen”. Meanwhile the women are virgins, but keep believing their vaginas are holy, so when they turn 30-35, they are narcissistic virgins who overvalue their sexual market in the name of “chastity”. They will marry, have sex with you, realize sex with you wasn’t all its cracked up to be, want a child to make up for their loss, then leave you in the dust. If they don’t leave you, they will just resent you. It’s not love that’s keeping them there: it’s ego and stubbornness, unwillingness to show their family back at home overseas the shame of separating. Their relatives will then curse them if they find out they cheated or left for no reason. Unlike American women, Nigerian women HAVE to demonize you as a husband in order to have peace of mind when they leave you. They can’t say “he wasn’t the one”. They have to say “He was the devil made flesh”. Then boom. They feel God is on their side. Sickening.

I wish you luck in this. Please keep us posted on your development. I do not hate Nigerians or the culture. I just don’t agree with their evolving social norms in relation with female nature. It’s very backwards.

I have discovered a truly remarkable list of reasons why women are not necessary for a happy life, but alas this margin is too small to contain it.

[RebalancedParticipant 346]

UPDATE

Today, I turned up to court to find my ex with my sons (very approriate behaviour I don’t think!) she wouldn’t let them come over and they gave me a look like I’m the bad guy for messing up their holiday. I made sure I said when they walked pass ‘what kind of woman brings kids to court’? I have never spoke bad about their mother in front of them until today but seeing as I get accused of it anyway, thought I may as well say something which may stick in their mind or come to it in future and make them question it.

The court said she can have her passport back if she can prove she is going to return (flight tickets, verifiable address etc) till then the passports stay with tipstaff (court police). The negative parts of the CAFCASS reports I have now found out came from the same social worker who is a friend of my ex and got caught lying at the last so called ‘final trial’ (judge let her off).  They are basically rehashed, disproved allegations which have already been dealt with at court in the past so not too worried about them. Still, they are passed off as ‘gospel’ even without getting my side of things before filing the said report.

I’m now looking at a court date which is 2 months away now at least just for another directions hearing. So my ex doesn’t attend 5 times, asks for the date to be made in the school holidays, cancels that and asks for it to be when she is back at work (she has claimed she cant come to court because of work commitments, so will claim that she cant come again), the court of course allows this, even though it ordered that she is mandated to attend at the date she has now cancelled!

Looking back, I sometimes think, I could have just had her dealt with in an illegal way, did the time for it and then perhaps she would know not to keep f~~~ing around. This experience has been worse than time in prison (she let me go there too) so I sometimes think what would I have really lost if I’d gone that route?

Its hard not to think along destructive lines when faced with a she devil like this but f~~~ suicide, ‘if’ I ever did truly decide I want out of this world, it would be homicide before anything else. Perhaps due to my being an INTJ or other reasons, I don’t really do in between reactions, its either restraint for years as I’ve done or all out war when I finally switch.

Feel more justified if I withdraw but still hard to throw the towel in fully.

Appreciate that eye opening analysis Fermat.

 

 

 

 

I don't need pussy

[SteveParticipant 462]

Hang in there fella. Sounds like another s~~~ty day.

Hit the weights, go for a run or a night away with a tent. Whatever you can do to distress yourself and take some of the weight of your shoulders…

 

[Author]

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