Is it really the nature of women we dislike, or is it a human phenomenon

[Anonymous 0]

I am down with this MGTOW thing, don’t get me wrong, but I think a lot of the philosophy that is being attributed to women is simply a the way of humans…. It is just that most of us p~~~ed off and fed up heterosexual men relate the problem to the fact that we have tried to have meaningful relationships with women, and not with men. But I have found, throughout my wizened life of 50 years, that some of the greatest sociopathic villains I have crossed path with are men. Because we do not have children or buy homes for/with men, it is much more damaging when we cross path with a bitch who takes advantage of our need to insert our penis into a sweet vagina.

I think it is a sociological trend that the human race itself has been evolving to a point where we are almost reaching a majority of sociopathic individuals; male and female alike. Of course, women have eggs which are more rare, and sperm is abundant, so women’s notion of love is derived more from the need to find men who will be able to provide; and men, because our inherent drive is to spread or seed around, we tend to think of love as a physical acceptance by the possessor of the vagina. So it isn’t that women are so bad, when they are bad, it is just that mental disorder manifests differently in men. But it does happen to men too. We are just not bound to our buddies c~~~ and reproduction for our self esteem, as much. But let’s be clear… a man can be just as irrational, ego driven, lacking empathy and sociopathic as any women you have ever known.

What I am saying is, it is a statistical illusion to assume that a MGTOW should only “go their own way” from women. I think a true MGTOW goes his own way relative to other men and women. Women and men are more alike (genetically and sociologically) then they are different; and if I could rerun a few incidents in my past with men who were suppose to be friends or business partners, you would see what I mean. Men can be just as irrational and cruel as a woman, especially if they feel you are superior to them in some way; regardless if he is your best buddy from high school or if he is a family member.

Like I said, I believe in much of what MGTOWs are saying, but attributing it all to women, although true to some extent, it is more a personality thing, from person to person. I will bet money that many men that claim to be MGTOWs are simply hurt egos or even sociopaths, simply by statistical probability.

I have known many men who simply wanted to subjugate me, even destroy or kill me, just to reassure their own status. Women just tend to do it more covertly and passive-aggressively; which comes across as more “sly”. One thing I know about people, and not just women, is that people are always misrepresenting themselves; especially when we are talking Internet nerds. So I think many MGTOWs are “professing a bit too loudly”. 😉

All that being said, I think a MGTOW movement is going to grow over the decades, because we have a legitimate gripe. But I am not certain I could turn down the chance to spend some time inside of a woman half my age.

[WandersmannParticipant 27]

A man can be just as irrational, ego driven, lacking empathy and sociopathic as any women you have ever known.

1. That’s obvious (albeit it often manifests differently) and I doubt many MGTOW question that. Consider the other points before responding as they are related.
2. Women often aren’t held nearly as accountable as men because we’re biologically driven and socially conditioned to protect and idealize women so it makes sense to uncover the dark side of female nature for a change.
3. Some of the behavior MGTOW often talk about isn’t general sociopathy but deeply rooted in female nature, for example hypergamy and the “borg consensus” (aka sisterhood).

 

 

But I am not certain I could turn down the chance to spend some time inside of a woman half my age.

The question isn’t if you’d take it for free but what price you’re willing to pay and what risks you’re willing to take.

 

 

** Sorry for testing the report button, I expected a popup haha.

[John DoeParticipant 743]

I had similar thoughts.

The reason the woman issue is brought up is because the MGTOW movement is comprised primarily of heterosexual men and sex is a major part of life.  Get men together and they discuss either women’s, sports, or politics/religion/philosophy.  Usually women is the top of the conversation though.

With that being said the whole “brother watching your back” thing is dead also.  MGTOW deals a lot with relationships with women because as I said sex is a major part of life.  However, it is also about dealing with fellow males in the business and social world.  Men interact with women differently than men interact with men.  Different issues result from each.

[Anonymous 0]

Yes… I agree completely… and I understand. I just want to see how much critical thinking could be addressed in this forum.

I think it has more to do with addressing a “conscious brain”; and that is what MGTOW is attempting to be (conscious awareness of women). But in order to that to be so I think a true MGTOW of the future will be more and more open to introspection– and I don’t mean the kind of self-doubt or self-analysis that some bitch will use to “fix” a man. I am talking about opening up more consciousness by looking in the mirror.

The first thing I noticed about MGTOW, is that ever since the movie The Matrix every philosophical group uses the “Red Pill” analogy to describe their philosophy as the one that is “awakening to the truth”. Ironically, when I was being critical of “The Secret”/”The Law of Attraction” they were constantly trying to tell me I need to “take the red pill”; just before I heard of MGTOW, I was got interested in a Libertarian philosopher on YouTube, and he sells his gig with “take the red pill”, and that “red pill” reference is what put a MGTOW video suggestion on my YouTube feed….

Don’t get me wrong… I LOVE the red pill metaphor… but that is the point. Everybody loves that idea of taking the red pill because they want to FEEL as though they are being freed from a lower level of consciousness…. This is how cults and conspiracy theorists recruit believers… by making it seem as though they are freeing you from mind control of the establishment….

Yes…. I agree with MGTOW about 99% of the way. I just think that with ANY conscious awakening one must be open to all honest reasoning, even if that means looking in the proverbial mirror for incongruences, so that the philosophy evolves to more and more INTEGRITY.

All I am saying is that the issue with MGTOW is a philosophy, and in order for it to proliferate to the male population, it should be able to hold up to critical thought… thus being legitimized.

[TemperedParticipant 55]

Humans are not evolving to a majority of sociopaths. Altruism decreases drastically when resources are scarce. That is what you are seeing.

A man is limited in ways he can legally make your life miserable. That is, unless you marry him. While possible, I don’t think that represents a majority of MGTOW; and thus you have your answer.

Why is MGTOW  a reaction to the realities of dealing with women? I can share some of my thoughts.

1. Females are more impressionable than males. Like a sponge that can’t help but absorb liquid, women absorb toxic beliefs and propagande spewed out of society’s every corner in great quantities. Think feminism, marxism, male privilege..
2. The government and its laws are set-up against the male, and in favor of women.
3. Our beloved FIAT, crony-capitalistic economy is perfoming horrible, and is on the verge of collapse. Poor economy and bleak future prospects has increased hypergamy.
4. Females are by nature egoistical and manipulative (there are evolutionary reasons for this).
5. Sexual liberation.

Take these five points and mesh them together. What do you get? -The modern woman.

MGTOW is a sane decision in an insane society.

 

[John DoeParticipant 743]

All I am saying is that the issue with MGTOW is a philosophy, and in order for it to proliferate to the male population, it should be able to hold up to critical thought… thus being legitimized.

You are under the false assumption that the majority of males are critical thinkers and want the same thing you do.  If looked at as a “movement” MGTOW can stand up on its own two feet.  Men are leaving society due to corruption and a variety of other reasons.

If looked at as a philosophy it fails in one aspect, but succeeds in another.

It fails at being totally rational.    Men Going Thier “Own” Way is a very subjective statement in that “way” is subject to the “Man/Men” ‘s desire.  Desire in and of itself is not rational.

It succeeds in that most of the modern philosophers, in their attempt to use “reason” only, have ended up with either irrational premises and/or predicates to their arguments.  In other words the masses will adapt a philosophy whether it is rational or not.

One eery observation I have made throughout the years, is the the hardcore MGTOW members who take it as a philosophy also literally follow(ed) writers/philosophers who have involved themself in the occult and/or satanic philosophy.  I don’t intend this sound dramatic or conspiratorial, however I have observed alot of religions and philosophy, and some of the hardcore guys seem to follow this line and even pushed similiar authors.  Google the philosophical laws of satanism and you will find that the hardcore members seem to knowingly or unknowingly push these “laws” alot.

On the other hand there seem to be me a small minority of religiously minded men who are here due to observations of societal corruption.  These seem to be more of the movement type.  They either observed or experienced societal corruption and are trying to learn how to survive and deal with it.

Besides these two groups, which are real small, there are a bunch of guys who are just flat confused with what is going on and are looking for direction were ever they can get it.  I would say this is the majority of the members.

[BrianParticipant 87]

The key is that by and large women have s~~~ty character, but up until 60 years ago there were controls in place to account for that.  Their character is still s~~~, but the controls are now gone.  A fellow mgtow here likened it to giving a toddler a loaded gun to play with.  That’s about as “critical” as critical thinking gets.

[Anonymous 11]

I’m going to roll with Brian K.’s point on 60 years ago.

I was born to way older parents as in nearly 50 years old when I was conceived, and I’m pushing 50 myself. My mother was from the old school.  Even though she could chick out sometimes, she was the most level headed and strong woman one could ever meet.  She often remarked how FUBAR’ed and crazy women my age and younger are.

I was born at the bra burning stage of feminism in the 60’s.  My sister is old enough to be my mother, and she rabidly hates feminism.  I think this f~~~ed me up as a growing young lad I was only exposed to women who had not been poisoned by feminism so CP was in for a rude awakening when he hit the world with the feminist poisoned sluts who made up his dating pool.

My father was the most manly cat you could ever meet a veritable anti-mangina.  His influence was why no woman could ever make me submit to her, and brothers, CP has paid a huge price for his long term refusal to submit to female dominance.  Even in my blue pill days, I would never submit to them.  I drove them f~~~ing apoplectic.  Luckily, my oddball upbringing saved me from the ruination of marriage.

Modern women are nothing more than poisonous narcissistic snakes so treat them as such.  It really sucks that I have to even say s~~~ like this.

[Anonymous 0]

Tempered,

That is your opinion.

It is legitimate and up to the individual to choose to “go their own way” because one does not like the nature of women. However, it is even more clear to me than ever that in order for that to be a conscious decision one must not feel that the true nature of women is to be feared…. Most MGTOW men will not admit it openly, but their opinions are based on the fact that they are deeply attracted to the nature of females, but FEAR not being able to control the female…

See, it ABSOLUTELY is a power game. Men who feel powerless in the intermingling with females will rant and rave about it, while a TRUE master of taking the “red pill” will not even have a second thought about his choice to “go his own way”…. It is ABSOLUTELY TRUE that what most MGTOW men are doing is analogous to a bully stealing their lunch money and the victim saying, “Oh, I didn’t want to eat lunch today anyway.”, as they try to minimize the truth, that they are not in control….

Power and control…. The difference between an honest MGTOW, me, and a dishonest MGTOW is that I am willing to admit the truth that I resent that women have used me because I was weak; and dishonest MGTOW are refusing to admit that they have a weakness for women. In other words, pseudo-MGTOW are victims, and are trying to use “going their own way” as a passive-aggressive “Take that, ladies who have hurt me!”, and what really p~~~es them off is if the ladies don’t care…

The ultimate, and what I like about MGTOW, is that the concept is to reach a state of not needing or caring at all, to the point where you don’t even have to discuss it.

[icering87Participant 11]

Here is my take.  The MGTOW movement is a natural movement based on human nature.  All beings of all kinds are out for themselves and own well being.  The MGTOW philosophy is natural because of the pain and discomfort most men are having in life which can be rooted to the modern western woman.  But thats in this case.  If there was a sudden culture change then the focus would be elsewhere.  Mammals know only to fight, flee, or freeze to avoid a direct threat.  Up until now men froze, then ran, but I feel we have been cornered and are fighting for survival at this point which has given birth the the MGTOW.   Some may say its a flee strategy but I think its a fight strategy.

More and more men are realizing that something is wrong and in my case I am here because I was a nice guy who took so much verbal abuse I snapped and went to war with a woman and learned of something inside me I wasn’t aware of and went through an intense personal development journey around the world.  Crazy life story.

But when it comes to women, its just a brain we are dealing with.  It was taught things, just like the white knights which I use to be a member of.  It was taught.  So Its not women to blame, its the modern garden variety women you run into everyday and what they’ve been taught they can do.  And because they process more emotions that us me, the results for us is highly unpredictable.  For women, each emotion is almost a different personality so what was said when she was happy doesn’t transfer to when she’s mad.  For men you can assess the data on your phone, tablet, smart watch, and computer.  For women its different documents for each system with no cloud sync.

But as I sad in the beginning, all living being are looking for well being and right now for a man the risk of unhappiness is very high when dealing with the modern woman in the traditional ways of dating, marriage, live in girlfriend etc… the drama that can enter your life isn’t worth the gains.  you’d have a better chance of profit building daycares in Japan right now.

[Anonymous 0]

Chauvinist,

I agree completely. I am no fan of the feminist movement. My point is that man with a true pair and a notion of self-empowerment will know that by ranting and raving he is proving that he is not completely devoted to “going his own way”…. Just going his own way without resentment is the “red pill” master’s way….

I will be the first to tell you, I am no master. I still am effected by relationships long gone. In order for me to be truly free of this, I must learn to “let it go” completely. Openly expressing myself as a “chauvinist pig” is not “letting go” and “going my own way”….

The feminist movement, and the nature of women, should be totally irrelevant to a MGTOW…. THIS is how you take your power back.

[Anonymous 0]

Icering87,

I like your analysis of the situation… In fact, the notion of “not blaming women” is key. You do not seem to hold any vengeful anger…. Feeling hatred towards women is irrational, and is how men surrender power to them….

Like I mentioned above… what drew me to MGTOW was that it seemed to be based on the RATIONAL understanding that women cannot take personal power from us if we don’t give it to them (a la “going my own way”).

[GoneGaltParticipant 361]

@icering87 – the drama that can enter your life isn’t worth the gains

The only thing I would change is from ‘can enter’ to ‘will enter’. It is amazing to me how strong the biological impulse is for men to hit that pussy including me. But at the end of of all the great discussions, I’m left with this – what do women bring to the table that we need? The answer to me is just pussy, and that does not demean my mother who was a fantastic woman, but if Mom didn’t have a pussy then Dad would never have chatted her up in the first place. Men get with women because they have the sexual power, but if women didn’t then they’d be an endangered species in a heartbeat because no hetero man would put up with their s~~~ without the promise of pussy.

I have already exited 2 friendships with women that were one-sided, and one of them was due to my discovering the precepts of MGTOW. She doesn’t know about MGTOW because I simply shut her out (I had reason to – she screwed me financially but I only found out in December, it’s straightforward but I don’t want to talk about it in a public forum for privacy reasons). The only good relationship I now have with a woman is my brother’s wife, and damn she is a good woman, she’s there for him no matter what and right now he’s been diagnosed with cancer the 2nd time in 4 years, with this cancer a different one that before. She’s old school, like my Mom. But as good as my mother was she left me with beta baggage, that I should always be a nice guy with women. Yeah, that f~~~ing served me well.

At this stage in my life, women can go service themselves with a vibrator – they are so far from being worth the effort to engage it’s not even funny.

 

 

[icering87Participant 11]

In my case I have no hate or vengefulness but at one time I did,  I think its necessary for most because a lot of guy have had their power taken and only through MGTOW have they learned they can regain it.  So letting go will take time for some.  Once you hit a certain level of personal power your emotional bank account will be loaded and most things women do won’t effect you.  A lot of guys have built up range that needs to be released and this is a platform for it, once its out I think thats where the personal growth comes in.  Everyone is at different levels.  So you’ll get a mix of thoughts.

[StargazerParticipant 12505]

I would argue that what we are seeing WRT female behavior today is not a cultural aberration but their true nature unbound.

In the past, the worst aspects of feminine power were contained by their utter dependence upon men for basic survival. One can only behave so badly as a female in a relationship when the man has the ability to simply let you starve and die. But now that females have obtained economic agency backed up by social convention and the force of law, they feel free to exercise their power to its fullest… and we all know that unchecked power corrupts.

My underlying assumption here is that both males and females have equal and complimentary powers… males the power of creative destruction and females the power of social organization. When males and females needed each other, they checked each other’s powers and there was a tendency for those powers to be used for constructive purposes… but now that we are operating under the illusion that we no longer need each other, both sets of powers are inclined to go unchecked… and female power, being lionized by society now regardless of how it is used, has run amok. If we were doing with our power what females are doing with theirs, the world would be on fire by now… but they get away with it and thus we have the situation where men, recognizing that female power has run wild, are moving to snuff it at its source… by taking its win condition (control over us) away.

So in summary, it’s not females that are the problem or even their basic nature… it’s the unchecked destructive application of female power that is the problem and the only way to stop it is to burn the ground it would feed on.

[Anonymous 11]

@wes;

Thanks for the comment on my handle.  Actually, I chose it as a statement of going my own way and demonstrating that I no longer care what women think which is not the same as hating women.  I took what used to be used quite often as a shaming tactic against men and adopted it.  Don’t let the hens know this, but I’m really not a true angry chauvinist pig. However, I do go my own way with regards to them as they have forced me into this stance over many years,

Also, I left any resentment behind 18 years ago.  Holding on to resentment binds you to whatever you’re trying to escape. I’m just doing whatever I can do to reduce the amount of gynocentrism in our culture.  I try to plant seeds in men and open minded females that we are going down the wrong path.

Now, if anyone is “offended” by my handle, it’s OK as the Sun will still rise the next morning.

That’s the beauty of MGTOW you and I can each do it in our own way.

[harpo-my-“SON”Participant 2410]

My father did not hate women, but would be the first to say men are superior. For this reason women would try and shame him with the term“chauvinist pig” and state that he was not superior to them, at which point he would throw his arm on the table and say lets arm wrestle then. I always found that funny as it would shut them up fast.

I was bound to be misunderstood, and I laugh at those who misunderstand me. Kind mockery at the well intentioned, but unfettered cruelty towards those would be prison guards of my creative possibilities. This so as to learn as much from misunderstanding as from understanding. Taking pleasure in worthy opponents and making language fluid and flowing like a river yet pointed and precise as a dagger. Contradicts the socialistic purpose of language and makes for a wonderful linguistic dance, A verbal martial art with constant parries that hone the weapon that is the two edged sword of my mouth.

[Anonymous 11]

@harpomason:

That sounds like something my dad would have done.  This constant propaganda stream where woman are portrayed as equal or more often than not superior to all men is bulls~~~.  We are meant to be complementary by the fact of our biological evolution.

All modern feminism has done is to exacerbate the fundamental weaknesses of women while artificially inflating them with strengths they do not possess.  It has also undermined the strengths of men along with inflating men’s weaknesses. Modern feminism is a philosophy of pure hatred and a destroyer men, women, and civil society at large.

[Anonymous 42]

Stargazer wrote:

I the only way to stop it is to burn the ground it would feed on.

Hey doc, may I elaborate, The Feminist uprising is kin to several atomic meltdowns, along with multiple above ground detonations, resulting in the contamination of all farmlands throughout the globe…This contamination will remain extremely toxic for over 300yrs.

Like cattle these feminists will consume the contaminated grasses and grain, we’re just the farmers that have walked away from this atrocious process, weather we burn the fields, or not, the contamination will run it’s course.

Men being “sociopaths” absolutely, they hold a high bequrel (roentgen) count from this contamination…

I had friend (moved to CO.) His brother was savagely murdered by one of his  friends, him and his brother were marshal-arts advanced, he broke up a fight between the killer and his girlfriend (bruising his ego) he was thumping her without mercy, and was stopped! Later on that evening they went out to party, the murderer reached around from the back seat with his knife, and sliced his neck wide open, the driver stopped, and before anybody could do anything, the murderer was outside the car stabbing him repeatedly, this incident happened in the small town of Ware Massachusetts, white on white violence… It was a lesson to me that nobility was dead, and so is he!

ChauvinistPig, our avatars are only avatars, this is something many don’t understand. I am like you, I have old school blood, My grandfather ran a speak-easy (a club during alcohol prohibition) he was given an ultimatum by Lucky-Luchianno (mobster) to sell his business or eat lead, he sold out, and was given a #racket to run. He was the silent type, but everybody respected him as he raised five children on his own, My mother was the oldest, and started mothering “his” family at the age of five years old… They don’t make women like her anymore. The new women are selfish, greedy, opportunistic, and most of all “organized” for more than 50 yrs. It’s far to late to save this society, It’s poisoned with generational toxins…

I dwell in complete mental safety, my “BUNKER”!

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[Anonymous 11]

MG-Tower: I love your radionuclide contamination analogy to this situation.  Going underground is the only way to escape.  I agree that things have progressed to far to reverse in my lifetime.  In fact, I expect it to get even worse.

However, gynocentrism has sown the seeds of its own eventual demise.  The MGTOW acorn will become a mighty oak tree over many, many years.

Your killer psycho white knight/mangina story is one reason I like to keep this on the down low as white knights are usually being manipulated by their “damsels in distress” so they are highly emotionally charged and dangerous.  I can handle a psycho screaming feminist, but a crazed man is a different story.  The genes for white knight behavior may have served a purpose back in the cave dwelling hunter gatherer years, but are a liability in this technological society where women are shielded from many dangers by default.

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