athiest mgtow

[harpo-my-“SON”Participant 2410]

You very much convinced me Elemental that I am in error, in my approach and overlooked something that should have been obvious to me when setting up this f~~~ed up experiment …would a woman ever admit error?  Non believers can and do have many positive attributes…they are very logical and observant for sure… not sure how open minded as they do seem bent on converting the faithful..

Oh and google harpomason I have doxed myself…the first 13 results should convince someone astute as you the truth about my gender… I didn’t realize how unique my screen name was when I chose it….your avatar will be among the images of my stonework…web results, 9th down the list is a pinterest account I set up and never logged back into, with my real name and a picture…Challenging someones gender is  serious matter in here…There are recordings of my drunken voice linked here at mgtow…No female has the forethought to set up a strong male internet presence, years old just to publish things like this on urban dictionary: http://www.urbandictionary.com/author.php?author=HarpoMason

I was bound to be misunderstood, and I laugh at those who misunderstand me. Kind mockery at the well intentioned, but unfettered cruelty towards those would be prison guards of my creative possibilities. This so as to learn as much from misunderstanding as from understanding. Taking pleasure in worthy opponents and making language fluid and flowing like a river yet pointed and precise as a dagger. Contradicts the socialistic purpose of language and makes for a wonderful linguistic dance, A verbal martial art with constant parries that hone the weapon that is the two edged sword of my mouth.

[J.D SilvernailParticipant 383]

I have faith in an atheistic religion called Laveyan satanism because it works for me(christianity,judiasm, Islam, Buddhism ,hinduism, are all false). It’s as simple as that. I do however believe in some aspects of paganism.

I'm married to the game,but she broke her vows.

[John DoeParticipant 743]

Now it is my turn.

Athiesm claims the importance of “reason only”.

Here is the definition of Reason as a noun:

1.

a basis or cause, as for some belief, action, fact, event, etc.:
“the reason for declaring war.”
2.

a statement presented in justification or explanation of a belief or action:
“I dare you to give me one good reason for quitting school!”
3.

the mental powers concerned with forming conclusions, judgments, or inferences:
“Effective leadership requires a person of reason.”
4.

sound judgment; good sense.
5.

normal or sound powers of mind; sanity.
6.

Logic. a premise of an argument.
7.

Philosophy.  a.the faculty or power of acquiring intellectual knowledge, either by direct understanding of first principles or by argument.
b.the power of intelligent and dispassionate thought, or of conduct influenced by such thought.
c. Kantianism. the faculty by which the ideas of pure reason are created.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/reason

 

Reason cannot exist on its own without faith.  Even faith in sensory experience is required.  Atheism requires faith, but attacks those who use it.

 

[John DoeParticipant 743]

I had a whole post just disappear, this is the second time in a week.

 

[John DoeParticipant 743]

This is the third or forth time that I have tried submitting the same post and it will not go up.

[John DoeParticipant 743]

Yellow Wizard wrote:

Statements that together form a reason for a conclusion are referred to as arguments. Your supposed “problem” (which no rational atheist would ever claim anyway) is not a premise as you claim at all, it is demonstrably an argument. “If…then…” is the format of an argument, not a premise.

A premise uses a  proposition.  Last time I check arguments can be used as propositions.  An argument can also have multiple premises, this does not eliminate the use of an argument as a premise for a separate conclusion.

Definition of Premise: 1.

Also, premiss. Logic. a proposition supporting or helping to support a conclusion.
3.

Law.  a.a basis, stated or assumed, on which reasoning proceeds.
b.an earlier statement in a document.
c.(in a bill in equity) the statement of facts upon which the complaint is based.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/premise?s=t
Athiesm uses this argument as a premise to the conclusion that their is no God.

Yellow Wizard wrote:

You use the term philosophy to mean belief, argument, collection of data, or whatever you want in any given post. You do this with other critical words as well. In so doing, every post you make illustrates the fallacy of equivocation, or using two or more meanings for the same term. It makes everything you say confusing gibberish.

Philosophy:

1.
the rational investigation of the truths and principles of being, knowledge, or conduct.

2.
any of the three branches, namely natural philosophy, moral philosophy, and metaphysical philosophy, that are accepted as composing this study.

3.
a particular system of thought based on such study or investigation:
the philosophy of Spinoza.

4.
the critical study of the basic principles and concepts of a particular branch of knowledge, especially with a view to improving or reconstituting them:
the philosophy of science.

5.
a system of principles for guidance in practical affairs.

6.
an attitude of rationality, patience, composure, and calm in the presence of troubles or annoyances.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/philosophy?s=t
It is difficult not to have the “fallacy of equivocation” when the word as multiple meaning literally.  In some effect, every word ever written can have this argument applied to it.  After all, the list of words with multiple meanings in the english language is very few.  I have not misused the word in any of its definitions.  With that being said Atheism gives no definition of Proof or Evidence.  It is a philosophy based on the “fallacy of equivocation”.  There is no set standard or definition for these things.  Atheist demand proof or evidence but never list a standard of what that proof or evidence should be.  It is a very subjective term.

Yellow Wizard wrote:

You, however, use the term “fallacy” mindlessly and without explanation. Quaint phrases like “…fall(s) flat on its head…”and “…collapses in on itself…” are meaningless knee jerk attacks.

You state I use “the term “fallacy” mindlessly and without explanation” then give a bunch of quotes where I do not use it at all.

Yellow Wizard wrote:

Why do you do this? You claimed on an another thread that you have taken “500+ level” courses in Logic.

John Doe wrote:

On a personal note, I have gotten A’s and B’s in 400+ level courses in college with little to no studying. Other students would study all night and get C’s and D’s. I am not impressed by his B.A. in philosophy.

Post 34129.  You did not even quote me correctly.

[John DoeParticipant 743]

There is it, sort of.

[John DoeParticipant 743]

Uh…Hi….me…. again.  I am going to cheat and take a 3rd turn.  My computer is s~~~ty and I cannot type much into one post.

Yellow Wizard wrote:

You could encourage humanism, ethics, evidence based reasoning, or any number of SECULAR notions on the atheist side, Harpo.

There is no set standards of ethics created by Athiests.  Even Sam Harris, Rainman’s favorite author did not come up with a scientific solution to ethics.  In regards to “evidence based reasoning” this is a faulty premise because Athiests give no strict definition for what that evidence consists of.

Yellow Wizard wrote:

Atheist bashing (in the form of pro “faith” sophistry) is happening on the atheist thread, yet you do nothing to discourage it. You fold your arms in front of you and act like a troll. Meaningful arguments are being repeated over and over again (such as Qbeck’s notion that critical thinking and reasoning requires positive evidence for the existence of something in order to formulate belief).

We are not bashing atheist’s, we are just saying their arguments are subject to a lot of criticism and do not make sense.   Take for example, Qbecks notion.  What would that positive evidence have to consist of exactly?  Because if you don’t have a set standard definition for what that evidence is, then your argument can fall into a fallacy of equivocation.   Also Qbeck’s notion is inexact because how many things do we believe because of what other’s said?  Take for example a million dollars in cash.  Most of us have never seen this, but we believe it exists because someone else says so.

 

 

Yellow Wizard wrote:

You try to shame the atheists (or antitheists, in my case) in your topic introduction by asking… “Is atheism hatred of religion and religious people? Do you Hate the people next door? Can you refrain from going next door and telling them?” Which aren’t questions you ask on the “faith” side, implying that atheists are haters. To make it fair, on the “atheist” side, why didn’t you ask… “Is religion hatred of secular people? Do you hate the atheists and secular humanists next door? Can you refrain from going next door and telling them?”

Actually this is a solid question.  Terminal Meme is an atheist and he has blatantly called many religious people many unneccessary names.  There are many other Athiests who have similar opinions such as Hitchen, Maher, Harris, Neitzche, Stalin, etc.

Now let us make it fair and take the Atheist side.  Last time I check many religions have taken secular authorities and people as legitimate.
“Give to Caesar what is Caesar’s.”

Another point I should have asked, is what do you mean by hate?  Is it to disagree with?  What exactly?  Because if you do not have a strict definition then you would fall for the fallacy of equivocation.  But you knew that already.

I don’t hate athiests, I just think they are irrational.  Many claim reason only, but use assumptions/theories/faith based premises to justify their conclusions.  Even the statement such as “I only believe what can be observed” requires a faith that one is not deceived/can see it all/all knowledge is sensory experience/etc.

Before you respond, let me save you the trouble.  You will say “my argument is not logical/I am stupid/I am making up
words/I do not have correct form in writing/I am irrational/etc.”  There I saved you the trouble.  Now point out where
exactly.  Give me examples please.

 

 

[Anonymous 42]

@johnd, I lost a couple of posts too, you’re not alone, I have a feeling harpo may have been compromised through Google’s lack of security, I was reading about it yesterday, he seems to have disappeared, just like his definitions on urban dictionary, “dissapeared”. hmmmm?

Oh yea, “faith” when you’re walking along isn’t it faith in action when you expect to land on your foot, from step to step? What I mean is, it hasn’t happened yet, but you “believe” it will. And what about premonition? Seeing things that didn’t even happen yet? And what about ancient predictions recorded in the Bible, and the fact that these predictions have systematically transpired in lock-step? Hmmmmm.

I don’t want to argue endlessly with anybody, y’all can believe anything you want, I don’t hate or even dislike anybody for what they believe, that’s their belief, It’s not up to me to grant anything to anybody, I’m just a traveler through time like everybody else…….

[John DoeParticipant 743]

Anonymous wrote:

I lost a couple of posts too, you’re not alone, I have a feeling harpo may have been compromised through Google’s lack of security, I was reading about it yesterday, he seems to have disappeared, just like his definitions on urban dictionary, “dissapeared”. hmmmm?

What definitions?  He has been going through the same?  Is it just us or everyone else on the site?

[Anonymous 42]

Harpo’s “MGTOW” definitions have disappeared, I believe he was hacked via google insecurities, It may explain his absence. I lost a couple of posts and left click on any given word has revealed a glitch in my browser or on this site, I get a wormhole picture, and spell-check gets freaky, a ghost bar with the word appears stretched across the top of my screen. I’m going to do a scan NOW! Adios till later….

******************************************************************

P.S. here’s his last communication that I could find 7:53 AM EST

******************************************************************

I am on one of 5 machines I have.  Two of which I could care less about. They are old UNIX laptops given to me, using sandbox virtual os just to open emails from urban dictionary now… My desktop the machine my favorite is infected, I am , running scans malwarebytes, will run a  highjackthis log on boot-up. …I noticed the desktop was acting strange at around 8:00am A couple hours later when all this happened I  looked to the clock in the corner it said 7:52am and did not change. I knew then the machine was infected  most likely by an email I opened…..I now believe KeyMaster was right about it being urban dictionary but they sent an infected email so they didn’t have to crack or hack, and they could make it appear  I un-published my own definitions…publishing is automated and done by votes. Un-publishing can only be done by the author of the definitions, as only when I log in can that button be seen…If they were gonna mess with me from the site itself they could just erase all my work and ban me from the site..They left my account and other definitions alone…I will have it published again by the morning..

 

[KeymasterKeymaster]

OK first of all, it’s not “Harpo’s definitions”. We wrote the definition of MGTOW on our about page last year. And Harpomason took it upon himself (in the last couple of weeks) to submit it for consideration as a “better definition of MGTOW” than the current high-ranking one. Aparrently, those definitions have been removed from Urban Dictionary for consideration. If anyone wants to read more on the topic.. here it is.

/forums/topic/the-definition-of-m-g-t-o-w-urban-dictionary-voting/

While MG-Tower said “VOTE FOR Harpomason’s DEFINITION OF MGTOW” (as seen in his signature)…. it wasn’t Harpomason who wrote it, it was HarpoMason who had gone through great lengths to push it to the front. Yesterday he believed someone logged in to Urban Dictionary as him and removed his submissions for consideration, but it’s clearly more likely that someone else just wanted to be a dickhead.

As far as posts “disappearing” are concerned. Please let us know with a link to the thread if you post and it doesn’t appear. about 0.1- 0.6% of posts go into spam and we can pull it out for you if that’s what happened. There is nothing by MG-Tower in Spam at the moment, but if it happens again just let us know.

If you keep doing what you've always done... you're gonna keep getting what you always got.

[Terminal MemeParticipant 57]

John: Apparently you don’t respect HarpoMason, who in the first sentence of this thread, said this is no place for debate. Meaning this is a place for atheists, freethinking, skepticism, etc… Not a place for Jesus junkies, like you, to come in here and post ten times more than everyone else. You’ve posted over 30% of the posts here! 

Get the f~~~ out of here! Someone delete all his comments. Do you see us dicking around in the Men of Faith room?! Have some respect! Get a job, get outside, get off the damn computer and live! We don’t care about your Crustian worldview in this room. You parade your ignorance all over the place and can’t respect the boundaries set (of the tolerant people who befriend you, Harpo. You s~~~ on him).

I tell you sincerely John Doe, I disagree with you on everything and I don’t like you much from what I’ve read but I’d rather hang out with you than a woman any day brother, but you need to respect the establishment of these rooms. We’re here to talk about atheist topics/literature/authors between atheists, not muck up another thread with your tired old, defeated Christian apologetics that even you aren’t familiar with because you don’t read books dude! 

To all Christians here, IMHO: You can’t go Your Way and Yewah at the same time. Educate yourselves and escape the restraints of dogma. If MGTOW is a statement of SELF ownership, then knowingly submitting to the ownership of god and going faiths way, jesus’ way, then you are violating what MGTOW is. MGTOW is progressive, not traditional bronze age slave brained crap. Educate yourselves with books, not the god damn internet and f~~~ing wikipedia. Read a god damn scientific journal at a college. But books written by Phd’s. But dont come to MGTOW with your Sermons and Proverbs and WHOLLY BABBLE quotes. Especially dont come in here with that s~~~. Respectfully leave this room at least. If you still think youre MGTOW, fine, I dont give a s~~~, as Ive gone my own way.

[Qbeck01Participant 57]

Elemental– When it comes to debate I’ve given up the idea that you can change someones mind. I view it as an opportunity to refine my skills of expressing my ideas as clearly and accurately as possible. Even as I re-read my posts I see where I misstep.
When debating religious people they do appear to be immune to logic. As the saying goes, “you cannot reason someone out of a position they didn’t reason themselves into.” Your tactic I’m sure is more effective. Showing them the harm they do rather than the foundations of their believes being irrational I’m sure has a better effect.

[Qbeck01Participant 57]

The problem with scientific atheism is that it’s fundamental premise is:  If man cannot understand it, then it must not exist.
That’s a fallacy: Straw man. That’s not a premise of Scentific atheism.
I hope you can understand the silliness of proposing something exists when you can’t even understand the thing you’re claiming to exist.
Silly guy: ” Hey everyone Goobally Gook exists! Worship Goobally Gook!”
Guy: “What are you talking about? what is this Goobally Gook? Please define it.”
Silly guy: ” It can’t be understood or defined…but he exists”
Guy: “If Goobally can’t be understood of defined how do you know it’s a he? Oh never mind you’re crazy go away”
Dropping names like  Aristotle and Descarte is a fallacy: argument from authority.
The ancient Greeks, though ahead of their time, believed a lot of crazy s~~~. Are you saying the Greek pantheon is real? Evidence and reason stand or fall on their own.

Faith is a necessity in many respects.  Man cannot know everything.  Here is a simple example: a million dollars.  Most people here have not seen a million dollars.  Yet many believe it be in existence.  Why?  Because of the faith they had in others observations.
Belief is only warranted when you have rational justifications for that belief. No exceptions. Just because someone can’t know everything doesn’t mean he knows nothing. What you describe with the “million dollars” example has nothing to do with faith. Knowledge from induction and extrapolation is what science is all about.
Either a god is apart of the natural universe and can be measured or it’s supernatural.
If God is a part of the natural world, aka super powerful alien, in which case it is still not right to believe in such a being until you have proof.
Or it’s supernatural and is synonymous with logically impossible.
Both cases you shouldn’t believe in god.

[Qbeck01Participant 57]

I am the type who claims the right to free will…claiming said right. I also have the right to change my stance on any issue.. I will frustrate the best debater…. I am the type that reads for fun…but makes up his own mind what to believe..I started the topic only as an experiment to see which room would be the most argumentative.. which room would debate and argue …even though I stated it was not what the topic was for…I have no need or reason to debate..I have my answer for which group feels the need to prove themselves, while at the same time perceiving themselves to be of superior intellect.  I have nothing to prove nor a need to try and change anyone’s beliefs or ideas…

That’s rather disingenuous. You start an MGTOW Atheist topic then spew some mystical wo wo about “nothing can be proven or dis proven” nonsense. Then, rather than justifying you’re quasi-religous B.S. you say “gotcha!, I’ve nothing to prove..free will and stuff.”

Either be willing to defend your ideas or keep them to yourself.

[Qbeck01Participant 57]

J.D Silvernail wrote:

I have faith in an atheistic religion called Laveyan satanism because it works for me(christianity,judiasm, Islam, Buddhism ,hinduism, are all false). It’s as simple as that. I do however believe in some aspects of paganism.

Faith is just another word for irrationality. Crazy people and irrational ones are indistinguishable. The Laveyan satanist adhere to a Machiavellian ethic. It has nothing to do with religion. Ethics is another topic altogether.

You people just like using the word satanism to troll religious people.

[Qbeck01Participant 57]

John Doe wrote:

Reason cannot exist on its own without faith.  Even faith in sensory experience is required.  Atheism requires faith, but attacks those who use it.

I’ve responded to this in a previous post: “While it is true there are fundamental axiom we must accept, this is not faith. They are considered necessary starting points. We assume, as an axiom that the external world does exist and we are not brains in a vat. Believing in Solipsism is an unfalsifiable position to hold.”

You’re using a fallacy: Equivocation. You expand the definition of faith so broadly as to include all axioms to gain agreement then use faith to mean religious faith. aka Belief in supernatural things without proof or evidence. Shame on you.

[Qbeck01Participant 57]

Anonymous wrote:

@johnd,  Oh yea, “faith” when you’re walking along isn’t it faith in action when you expect to land on your foot, from step to step? What I mean is, it hasn’t happened yet, but you “believe” it will.

What you describe isn’t faith. To equate believing in supernatural things as equivalent to believing the external world exists are two very different things.

 

 

Anonymous wrote:

And what about premonition? Seeing things that didn’t even happen yet?

I suspect you’re on drugs or you have selective memory. You forget premonitions when they don’t come true but only remember them when they do. I once dreamed of being at work, low and behold the next day their i was. I must be a gifted with the “sight”.

Anonymous wrote:

And what about ancient predictions recorded in the Bible, and the fact that these predictions have systematically transpired in lock-step? Hmmmmm.

Much like Nostradamus? You’re only seeing what you want to see. You’re reinterpreting gibberish to correlate with modern events.

[Qbeck01Participant 57]

I’ve expressed the same, How can take control of your life and follow your own dreams if you subjugate yourself to a religion? Serving women, serving a god. In both cases you are a slave.

Speaking of atheist authors, Sam Harris “The Moral Landscape” has been a great read..only on page 134 right now. Ethics has been stunted for far too long due to what passes for ethics in religion- Morals via threats of violence.

[Author]

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