A Good Post: An Open Letter from MGTOW Reddit

[RealityBitesParticipant 2198]

from: https://www.reddit.com/r/MGTOW/comments/abckvr/an_open_letter_to_the_pua_mra_incel_and_tradcon/

Some of the comments are really good..
—————————————
An open letter to the PUA, MRA, Incel and Tradcon refugees.
Welcome.
I imagine one of, if not the main reason, why you are here is because of the fact that this is the only place left online where the troubles of men are taken seriously and the truth is spoken without an ounce of pc bulls~~~.
In spite of whatever title we choose to adorn ourselves with, in my case I consider myself a MGTOW monk, we are all men living in this increasingly hostile society and it is becoming harder to ignore the blatant double standards in the treatment of men and women and men of all backgrounds are becoming very much fed up with it.
So, MGTOW grows. I’ve been here since the count was 27k on a couple accounts and that was only a year and a half ago. This growth will likely continue and men from other parts of the manosphere will come in larger and larger numbers.
Having said that I would like to dedicate a small paragraph to each of these generalized groups in an effort to help newcomers from these groups to see the similarities and differences with the MGTOW way of thinking.
To the PUA’s
Let’s be honest, PoundMeToo killed it. Men are now liable to legal action for so much as asking a woman on a date and God forbid if she sniffed alcohol, all of her decision making is warped beyond comprehension and she is not accountable for any one of her actions and you are a rapist. But that is not really my point of contention with this lifestyle, even tho that alone is horrible enough. It seems to me that it is the epitome of pussy pedestalization. To make the penetrating of a likely disease-ridden hole with your penis the goal of your life? Then proceed to sink hours and thousands of dollars in it. That to me is madness.
Yes, you guys use some evopsych as a base to game and manipulate women to bed them. The term evopsych in that sentence is just about the only common ground with MGTOW that PUA has. And even then, do you really believe you can manipulate a creature that evolved to manipulate? Can’t bulls~~~ the bulls~~~ter. If you are close to the top 20% then Pareto is on your corner and you’ll get lots of pussy. Hooray. And then there are false rape accusations and spermjacking that even the Greek gods are not immune to.
Having said all of that, I would like to extend an olive branch to you guys. It is understandable to be libidinous. The insane calculation of life demands procreation with brutal force. It is very difficult to fight this ancient drive, especially in such a hypersexualized society such as ours, where the number of vaginas you have penetrated has great social capital.
But when the chips are down, you have to make a choice: either you serve the master of evolution and insane pussy begging and put your life on the line in this legal climate or you find a new, better path.
To the MRA’s:
The MRM has been deemed a hate group. That is one of the saddest goddamn things ever. Don’t get me wrong, I am all for true equality in the justice system as much as the next guy but I am also a realist and worse, I understand female nature. Women will NEVER yield one single inch of power. Not ever. Very much to the contrary, the more they have, the more they want. Women are wild beats that when left to their own devices destroy the civilization men built.
You cannot argue with them, dialogue or reason. It does as much good as arguing with a wall.
You are welcome here as any man but do not expect marching bands to change the status quo. We understand that there are no lines of discourse open to men.
If women could no longer vote, and that will not happen btw, but if it did, you guys would have a real chance but as long as they can, there is nothing you can do but watch as they keep voting in increasingly insane and biased gynocentric legislation and there is nothing we can do other than walk away. MGTOW is not a movement. We are not anywhere holding signs trying to change laws. It is not that we don’t think the laws are bad, it’s just that we know it would be a complete waste of time to argue.
To the Incels:
Holy s~~~. The vitriol you guys have been subjected to defies description. You have been stripped of the status of human without a moment of hesitation. And your crime was losing the genetic lottery and by implication being shunned by the female. And much like the PUAs, you have become obsessed with pussy. Who can blame you? From the moment we are born we are bombarded with love and sex propaganda. We are led to believe it is the end all be all. Supreme happiness.
A steaming load of s~~~.
I have seen men on this forum state that there is no such a thing as an Incel for any man with 20 bucks can obtain female assisted orgasming. I however disagree. There is a whole other side to this situation because you guys are not only denied the physical aspect but also the entire experience of a relationship with someone that, in theory, cares about you.
As Stardusk puts it, it is impossible to relate to a situation you have not experienced but it is possible to understand it. And I understand fine that every single movie, TV show, soap opera and song boils down to sex and romance. Every billboard and TV ad. And then there is you. Shamed, blamed and humiliated because you cannot obtain it.
So let me tell you about a relationship. Yes, the honeymoon phase is intoxicating but it turns to s~~~ soon enough as s~~~-tests become ever more frequent and so does the fighting until you find out about the cheating and suffer for months after. Rinse repeat. You may be unable to relate but you can understand that it is bulls~~~. There is no happily ever after. No system of external validation lasts. MGTOW allows you to understand the equation that controls the acts of a liberated woman and how it always ends in simple hypergamy or the slow death of settling down with the betabux.
I know it is hard to deprogram when the vital experience that would help see the patterns is entirely denied to you. But this is the only way. Women would not improve your life. You would get high on dopamine for a little while only to be drowned in a sea of dread when the monkey branching procedures kick in.
To the Tradcons:
Patriarchal systems are the only ones that are known to create stable and strong societies that stand the test of time. At least we haven’t been able to think of any other working model thus far. I won’t argue that point, however, I will argue that this system works on the blood of men. And to work, a man must be paid and the coin is pussy. The key to the patriarchal success was in its assurance that hardworking men would have a guarantee to vaginal access and therefore a stake in societal success. Those times are gone.
The patriarchy died long ago and I for one am not sad about it. Waking up before the sun is out to work in a coal mine while my wife pushed buttons in the house? No thank you. I’d rather work less and not shave off a couple decades off my life expectancy.
The times of the tradcon will never return. Just get it thru your head. Even if you removed women’s rights. Even if society went back to policing the behavior of women, there is no going back for one main reason.
The age of information and connectivity. The internet has changed everything. Female nature plus the ability to easily connect with all the top 20% men in a 100-mile radius with the tap of a screen has destroyed any and all hope for societal stability. You’ll still get cucked and cheated on galore. Hell, even before technology it happened quite a bit just look at France in WW II when I think 60% (not sure of the % I just know it was really high) of women got pregnant while their husbands were away at war during German occupation.
Ok, that was a lot and I did not mean to be combative towards any of you even tho I may sound a bit harsh. It’s just that I do not believe in bulls~~~. And this place doesn’t either. This forum is many things, a comedy club, a fight club, a shrink’s office and a hospital for the male mind and all men are welcome. But it is not a place to foster fairy tale feel-good bulls~~~ views of the world or a place to sell hold frame bruh books or man up bravado.
MGTOW is refuge and fortress to any man seeking asylum from the insanity of the world today, and with its knowledge and wisdom, any man can save himself from the jaws of the gynocentric system.
I write this with the intent to help illuminate MGTOW to some of the newcomers from these other parts of the manosphere and also to welcome you guys.
In truth, we are all refugees, expelled from the comfortable home we had in the illusion by the harsh reality but by adapting and accepting the way things truly are we can forge a new path for ourselves.
So whether you are a PUA afraid of accusations or a disappointed MRA or a depressed Incel or a Tradcon looking for a religious NAWALT, welcome. I hope you stay and read and come to terms with the realities of this cold world we live in and, in time, let go of erroneous notions you may have previously held.
Happy New Year and GYOW.

[MarketWatcherParticipant]

Front and center on r/mgtow. A good read.

[SH3LLZParticipant 5569]

BRAVO!!!

#ICETHEMOUT!!! #MANOUT!!! #HIDEYOURWEALTH #VAGINAISWORTHLESS

[TaxGuyParticipant]

I actually kind of hate these open letters, because they make it sound like there is a stereotypical MGTOW and that we all think alike. And we don’t.

To PUA’s, I’d say good luck. Just understand that you aren’t being honest and karma can be a bitch sometimes. You may bang 100 women that are decent people that won’t get even when you ghost them but eventually you will run into a vindictive bitch that will go after you. And you’ll deserve it. You reap what you sow.

For the MRA’s, I don’t think that women shouldn’t vote, but they have to understand that grown-up actions have grown-up consequences. And just because your great-grandma MAYBE had a raw deal doesn’t mean that you do. But if you keep punishing the men of the present for the sins of the men of the past, we will eventually limit our contact with you. If the marriage contract becomes one-sided enough men will stop signing the contract. I say good luck to the MRA’s, but I don’t think they will be of much help. Today the only way you win is to be a victim, and men won’t be seen as a victim anytime soon. And that’s what turns you from a MRA to a MGTOW; realizing that the only way to win is to not play.

To the incels, well look, it’s one thing to be some ugly guy living in mom’s basement. We can all sympathize with that. But the crazies that talk about making women slaves or forcing them to have sex with you are what’s really keeping anyone from having sympathy for you. When someone says something like that they should be shot down immediately or everyone is going to be expecting you at the bell tower with a gun. Also, an average looking guy isn’t getting that much more sex than you and he’s being put through the ringer for it. And an average looking guy is probably busting his butt bettering himself, so get off your couch and get hustling. Whining isn’t attractive.

To the Tradcon, sorry buddy but that ship has sailed. You can’t unscramble the egg. What you should be looking for at this point is an equal partner. And that’s a tough find. But if you find a tradcon woman she’s more than likely a lazy chick that is just looking for a husbank and doesn’t really love you. And those are the one’s that get bored and start cheating on you. Is that really what you want?

Now, most importantly, that’s not an open letter from MGTOW. That’s an open letter from TaxGuy. And your mileage may vary. No one should ever be such an arrogant prick that they try to speak for the entire group of men here.

F~~~ that guy.

Order the good wine

[Gravel PitParticipant]

I clicked your 1+ but I don’t like this guy’s open letter much… in the spirit of GYOW right?! LOL

I agree with this writer’s friendly attitude. MRAs or Tradcons are great. I hope they win. In fact, I have said this a lot lately, I’m open to the idea of a relationship, cohabitating, marriage, kids etc… but I’ve put forth a case for why women do not try to have serious relationships anymore. We’re passed the days of the early 2010’s, it’s much worse now.

I WILL NOT CHASE WOMEN so I’m automatically left in a state of inactivity & celibacy. I have been “celibate” for 6 years now. I refuse to ask women out. I refuse to set up an internet dating profile. At 32 years old, it is NOT my responsibility to engage women. I tried tirelessly in my 20s. Those days are gone. Those years were mostly sexless too and I was alone. Where I tried to be proactive about women, I was rudely rejected. Where I was successful in procuring a relationship, I was soon sabotaged by her. I actually dated a single mom. I was not picky. But irregardless, I was treated VERY badly. So I’m done looking. In the age of female empowerment 2019, women need to be courageous and attempt to pick me up… funny right? We know that won’t happen. It used to be, a man made good money, so he would go find a woman to spoil her with that money and have a family. Now in 2019, women make really good money, but they don’t go try to find a husband to spoil him with it (equality right? why aren’t women acting like men now that we’re equal?). Instead, women spend all that money on themselves instead of starting families, the birthrate reflects this.

So when it comes to MRAs and Tradcons, I love them and hope they win. That said, you won’t see me picketing or believing for one second that laws will change, they wont. But as I stated above, we’re passed that now… the laws don’t even matter because women aren’t even getting married or having kids anymore. Its much worse than that now, much worse.

So where do I disagree with the writer?

Let me use his quote:

RealityBites wrote:

pussy pedestalization. To make penetrating a hole the goal of your life….

Oh brother, it’s MUCH worse than that. PUAs (where they actually exist, the term is mostly bunk in my view because real PUAs, who are actually VERY few in number, wholeheartedly deny such a belittling title and the people foolishly adopting the title aren’t Pick Up Artists at all, just undersexed, inexperienced adolescents who are trying to find a prom date. Men just don’t act like this, not in a serious way. Where did these dumbass labels like PUA come from anyway, mTV music videos in 1998? LOL. I digress, real PUAs have never even heard of ‘game,’ real PUAs, the ones getting more poon than a rabbit, are your run-of-the-mill Chads, Tyrones and Joses — sometimes they’re just jockish, GED holding low-lifes who defy the rules of the universe in regards to what women want… no one understands why Susan ruins her marriage by sleeping with the pool guy.

Other times, Chad is a lucky rich guy with tons of disposable income and a decent mug. The point of all this is, no amount of ‘game’ exists in this world. You’re either born with Chad Thunderc~~~’s personality, genes and money or you’re not. The so-called “Pick Up Artists” are little more than delusional 13 year olds (or having the maturity of one) who foolishly believe there is some string of words you can employ that removes panties, or that there is some set routine that ‘if you do this, you will get pussy.’ It’s a delusion. The term PUA is a joke… Oh, they exist, they’re just a bunch of dumbasses that get laid about as much as a mgtow MONK, which is near never.

PUAs are the ones fueling the infamous c~~~-carousel too. They are the ones putting c~~~-count on young women. They are the ones writing the statistics of failed marriage, divorce, abortions… They care nothing for the macro picture, but only for their temporary pleasure, the rest of us be damned. They are the ones who are as bad as feminists, dont ever forget that. They are NOT INVITED into this space at all if you ask me. SCREW THEM. I hate philanderers.

And finally, INCEL … the most bogus of all the labels. It shouldn’t even be a label, don’t use that term. The mere mention of it is invigorating to me. To even utter that term is to wrongfully shame men. Its like coming on here and saying “Man Up”

So what did Stardusk say?

RealityBites wrote:

it is impossible to relate to a situation you have not experienced but it is possible to understand it.

I hope I understand you right. But let me just say, Stardusk is wrong! (I get what he means but he still has not debunked INCEL and until he does, I unsubbed and will never donate to him again). I understand what they’re implying with regards to INCEL and it’s bunk. Just like with PUA, we have a bunch of uneducated twits self-identifying as something they know nothing about. They don’t understand anything about the whole picture. They dont understand their own sexuality, or women’s. They don’t understand the social-psychology behind a term like INCEL. They certainly do not understand things like Sexual Marketplace Value or feminism or hypergamy. All of the little boys (and wretched, stupid adult men) who use the term INCEL… all they understand is that they feel horny but there is no sex on offer.

INCEL: (involuntarily celibate) is a SHAMING term invented by a woman to deflect blame onto men for the continuously depreciated SMV of women. You see, women love having that implied, artificial, high-up sexual marketplace value. They love when society tells people that women are worth alot. That you need to spend money and effort to catch one. That you need to shower her with affection, consideration, gifts, attention and more. Indeed, society’s message is that you are not worthy of her. Just look at Kay Jeweler’s advert “You’re not marrying her, you’re marrying her whole world.” You’re not even better than her bastard child. You need to ask her bastard for permission to get her pussy. You have the low honor to ask for a woman’s sex, and only IF she deems you suitable, will you be granted access occasionally. NEVER QUESTION HER OWN QUALIFICATIONS. She is beyond that. You see, her SMV is beyond reach… OR SO THEY WANT YOU TO BELIEVE THAT LIE.

The real truth is that modern women have reached a new low, lower than their 1990s whorish 2nd wave feminists. Their SMV has been in a critical decline for decades. A woman’s company, the sex she gives, and the benefit she adds to a man’s life is now sooo worthless and undesirable, that such as thing as MGTOW (which is unnatural and shouldnt even exist) has become a real life thing. Men have such low standards and are so sexually driven, it’s unthinkable that a phenomenon like MGTOW MONK should ever exist, but it does!

You see, its a giant see-saw… women’s SMV is painted as this high up value… to keep it up there, men’s SMV has to be kept low. What better way to excuse the priced-out-of-market women’s SMV, than to crush men’s SMV by implying that there are hordes of men who are ugly, immature, unmarriageable, unlayable, perverted, misogynist and more… Do incels really exist? Or is it that women are on mass, more delusional than ever about the standard of men they deserve? Women are made to believe they deserve some standard of men that simply don’t exist in that quantity. So to hide their grandiose expectations, they paint half of men as slobs who are not even worthy of causal sex!

If you are an ugly, confused man. Or even a disabled guy. Do not be confused any longer. And definitely dont self-label as such a shameful term. It is NOT your fault. Nor are you involuntary about anything… you are not celibate. WOMEN are all brainwashed assholes. They are the problem. Nothing has changed with us for centuries. We’re all still a bunch of romantic young guys who would love to love a woman, even when times are tough, we settle for fatties and single moms. But now, women have reached a new low. They are the ones who are delusional about their sexual-worth, not us. We’re the same great men that have always been on offer.

[Gravel PitParticipant]

please repost my words on Reddit, maybe some will agree or even wake up… I dont have reddit. I get banned everywhere..

[Gravel PitParticipant]

TaxGuy wrote:

No one should ever be such an arrogant prick that they try to speak for the entire group of men here.

F~~~ that guy.

Iam often that guy lol. Sorry yall. Im a big loud mouth who types too much.

In real life, Im just a typical average guy. Unmarried, way underf~~~ed, no kids, not terribly handsome or rich, not low-down grummy or poor either though…just an average bloke.

[SH3LLZParticipant 5569]

TaxGuy wrote:

No one should ever be such an arrogant prick that they try to speak for the entire group of men here.
F~~~ that guy.

I do agree with your sentiment, but I dont think he was trying to speak for all MGTOW. I didnt get that sense. I read it as he was trying to give a blanket statement to the other men who are still blue and purple. WAKE UP ASSHOLES! Every many goes his own way in HIS OWN WAY.. But the PUAs, MRAs, and the INCELS are all so enamored with getting pussy, I think they need a good punch to the gut…

Just my two cents.

#ICETHEMOUT
#MANOUT
#HIDEYOURWEALTH
#VAGINAISWORTHLESS

#ICETHEMOUT!!! #MANOUT!!! #HIDEYOURWEALTH #VAGINAISWORTHLESS

[Gravel PitParticipant]

Gravel Pit wrote:

Do incels really exist? Or is it that women on mass, are more delusional than ever about the standard of men they deserve? Women are made to believe they deserve a standard of man that simply don’t exist in that quantity. So, to hide their grandiose expectations, they paint men as slobs who are not even worthy of causal sex! Thus the term Incel was born, to shame men, to deflect the truth about women’s low smv

[CarnageParticipant 22113]

My advice to all of those guys:

PUA, PUSSY IS WORTH IT, GO ON A RAPE SPREE. FIGHT SOME DUDES, SHOW YOU ARE THE ALFA MALE, INJECT SOME STEROIDS AND GO AT IT.

MRA, go take the weapons, start a masacre somewhere.

INCELS: Life has no meaning, blow your head off.

TRADCONS: DEUS VAULT, It is time to rise and masacre the muzzies, make the church great again and the women subserviant.

GO GO GO GUYS, GO KILL EACH OTHER, I GOT POPCORN, MAKE ME HAPPY.

F~~~ THOSE GUYS.

To those following me, be careful, I just farted. Men those beans are killers.

[TicParticipant 4329]

the best line from all of that was this:

“No system of external validation lasts. “

God bless peace and freedom.

[GrumpyParticipant]

Meh
You pay your dime, and you take your chances.
I’m just very very very selective and wholly aware of where, when, and why I pay my dime.
Everyone’s mileage will definitely vary depending on options and choices available.

There was a time in my life when I gave a fuck. Now you have to pay ME for it

[FunInTheSunParticipant 8283]

Excellent! I couldn’t have written it better.

"I saw that there comes a point, in the defeat of any man of virtue, when his own consent is needed for evil to win-and that no manner of injury done to him by others can succeed if he chooses to withhold his consent. I saw that I could put an end to your outrages by pronouncing a single word in my mind. I pronounced it. The word was ‘No.’" (Atlas Shrugged)

[Anonymous 1]

Good letter.

Hopefully, this pushes some Purple Pill guys into the Red.

I have slowly realized the truth about MRA as well. As long as women have the right to vote our system will be SOCIALISM. That’s just how it goes Women demand Welfare from the State and they don’t care how it gets paid for.

PUA are idiots. They have fallen victim to a Hyper-Sexualized media telling them chasing pussy is the ultimate goal in life. INCEL have also fallen victim to this media propaganda, but fail as PUA. INCEL are just failed PUA and spout off hatred and frustration. Both of these categories are not welcome here. Not unless they change their attitude and stop caring about pussy and getting laid.

Tradcucks are living in denial. Trying to hold onto a way of life that vanished in the 1950s.

[BrainPilotParticipant 7640]

There was a time when access to a vagina could only be offered to one man. It only had value if it was virgin. But that value was enormous. The value was half a man’s lifetime earnings, 100% of his attention, dedication, protection, etc. And nearly all men lined up to pay it. Many do not agree that that system was such a great deal for the individual man, and I am not arguing that it was. But it did seem to insure that the maximum number of men got access to at least one vagina during the course of their lives (and of course, it was a pretty good deal for women, for obvious reasons). That resulted in maximum productivity from men as a group, and that production was enormous. Civilizations formed. Governments formed. Armies formed. Labor unions formed. Empires were created. Populations were either stable or growing wherever this system existed.

Then, apparently, someone got the idea that that system was unfair and oppressive to women, and succeeded in making women, and many men, believe it. They got women to believe that they were owed something for all that ‘oppression’ they’d suffered. They also got women to believe that the man’s side of that agreement was a giant party, and that they deserved a piece of it. That system was essentially dismantled. Women were allowed to give vagina access to any, and as many low value men as they wanted. Promiscuity skyrocketed. Jobs were taken from men and given to women to allow them to support themselves while they gave devalued vagina away. STD’s went on the rise. Abortions on demand were made legal and available in every state, and the rates of them skyrocketed. Birth rates declined below sustainability levels. All sorts of artificial advantages over men were created and provided to women to allow this job shift to happen. Then lawyers created a system where any man dumb enough to line up to commit half his lifetime earnings to a woman would have those earnings taken from him and then discarded like a dead battery. Predictably, women went wild over that crap. >50% of marriages now end in jackpot payouts to women, and women are filing 70-80% of divorces that happen. It’s a s~~~-show.

For our part, men as a group have been slow to react. Like little retarded kids who have to be told to walk outside when the building is clearly on fire, men kept playing their role as we always had until fairly recently. The surprise of MGTOW is not that it exists, but that it didn’t come into existence 30 years ago.

If we just stop time here and look at where we are as a snap shot, what can we learn? First, we see that given a chance at easy short term gains for themselves, women can be convinced to ascribe to an idea that will wreck that social contract, destroy the lives of men, and end our civilization. And second, we see that men’s response to that has a delay of at least 30-40 years. Finally, we see that the response from men is divided. Aside from MGTOW, the responses have been PUA’s, MRA’s, tradcons, and incel’s.

None of them is restoring the birthrate, lowering the abortion rate, STD and divorce rates, or raising the marriage rate.

But MGTOW is the only choice that insulates a man from divorce rape, child support, STD’s, abortion of his child, paternity fraud, #metoo, etc. MGTOW is the one that best protects a man from being wrecked by one those advantages given to women to ‘compensate’ them for all that ‘oppression’ they suffered. If men cannot see this in the snap shot, or in the trends, it is either because they are blind to it, or because they are still in that 30-40 year delay. As I see it, the more progress the s~~~-show makes, the more men will align themselves into one of these reactions.

The smartest, most perceptive ones will go MGTOW by choice, and be grateful that they were smart enough to make that choice. INCEL’s will be MGTOW, and will be similarly protected, but will bitch about it because deep down, they aspire to be married tradcons or PUA’s. MRA’s are wasting their time trying to get their rights respected under the new system. Tradcons are wasting their time trying to restore the old one. This genie is not going back in the bottle.

Western civilization will disappear from inadequate birth rates alone.

But MGTOW will the men who best survive that event with their sanity, dignity, freedom and money intact. I can’t save this civilization, but I can save myself and assimilate into the next one…

Look, it's not my fault that tornado dropped a house on your sister. Now get back on your broom and get your ass out of here... and take your monkeys with you

[TaxGuyParticipant]

BrainPilot wrote:

Then, apparently, someone got the idea that that system was unfair and oppressive to women, and succeeded in making women, and many men, believe it. They got women to believe that they were owed something for all that ‘oppression’ they’d suffered. They also got women to believe that the man’s side of that agreement was a giant party, and that they deserved a piece of it. That system was essentially dismantled.

Pretty much the story about Eve and the apple. It’s been a truth since the writing of the bible, whether or not you believe in God.

Order the good wine

[hdvrodParticipant 1109]

BrainPilot wrote:

There was a time when access to a vagina could only be offered to one man. It only had value if it was virgin. But that value was enormous. The value was half a man’s lifetime earnings, 100% of his attention, dedication, protection, etc. And nearly all men lined up to pay it. Many do not agree that that system was such a great deal for the individual man, and I am not arguing that it was. But it did seem to insure that the maximum number of men got access to at least one vagina during the course of their lives (and of course, it was a pretty good deal for women, for obvious reasons). That resulted in maximum productivity from men as a group, and that production was enormous. Civilizations formed. Governments formed. Armies formed. Labor unions formed. Empires were created. Populations were either stable or growing wherever this system existed.
Then, apparently, someone got the idea that that system was unfair and oppressive to women, and succeeded in making women, and many men, believe it. They got women to believe that they were owed something for all that ‘oppression’ they’d suffered. They also got women to believe that the man’s side of that agreement was a giant party, and that they deserved a piece of it. That system was essentially dismantled. Women were allowed to give vagina access to any, and as many low value men as they wanted. Promiscuity skyrocketed. Jobs were taken from men and given to women to allow them to support themselves while they gave devalued vagina away. STD’s went on the rise. Abortions on demand were made legal and available in every state, and the rates of them skyrocketed. Birth rates declined below sustainability levels. All sorts of artificial advantages over men were created and provided to women to allow this job shift to happen. Then lawyers created a system where any man dumb enough to line up to commit half his lifetime earnings to a woman would have those earnings taken from him and then discarded like a dead battery. Predictably, women went wild over that crap. >50% of marriages now end in jackpot payouts to women, and women are filing 70-80% of divorces that happen. It’s a s~~~-show.
For our part, men as a group have been slow to react. Like little retarded kids who have to be told to walk outside when the building is clearly on fire, men kept playing their role as we always had until fairly recently. The surprise of MGTOW is not that it exists, but that it didn’t come into existence 30 years ago.
If we just stop time here and look at where we are as a snap shot, what can we learn? First, we see that given a chance at easy short term gains for themselves, women can be convinced to ascribe to an idea that will wreck that social contract, destroy the lives of men, and end our civilization. And second, we see that men’s response to that has a delay of at least 30-40 years. Finally, we see that the response from men is divided. Aside from MGTOW, the responses have been PUA’s, MRA’s, tradcons, and incel’s.
None of them is restoring the birthrate, lowering the abortion rate, STD and divorce rates, or raising the marriage rate.
But MGTOW is the only choice that insulates a man from divorce rape, child support, STD’s, abortion of his child, paternity fraud, #metoo, etc. MGTOW is the one that best protects a man from being wrecked by one those advantages given to women to ‘compensate’ them for all that ‘oppression’ they suffered. If men cannot see this in the snap shot, or in the trends, it is either because they are blind to it, or because they are still in that 30-40 year delay. As I see it, the more progress the s~~~-show makes, the more men will align themselves into one of these reactions.
The smartest, most perceptive ones will go MGTOW by choice, and be grateful that they were smart enough to make that choice. INCEL’s will be MGTOW, and will be similarly protected, but will bitch about it because deep down, they aspire to be married tradcons or PUA’s. MRA’s are wasting their time trying to get their rights respected under the new system. Tradcons are wasting their time trying to restore the old one. This genie is not going back in the bottle.
Western civilization will disappear from inadequate birth rates alone.
But MGTOW will the men who best survive that event with their sanity, dignity, freedom and money intact. I can’t save this civilization, but I can save myself and assimilate into the next one…

I think this is the best read I’ve had since I first joined this website. Holy s~~~!

Anyway communication, real open communication, is not wanted or even required in a relationship. Women cannot handle fully open and honest communication, plus most perceive it as a weakness on the part of a man. All that is required is catering to her whims, and even then nothing is certain. There is no way to be sure of having a successful relationshit with a woman. MGTaoist

[Ranger OneParticipant 16836]

hdvrod wrote:

I think this is the best read I’ve had since I first joined this website. Holy s~~~!

I concur.

All my life I've had doubts about who I am, where I belonged. Now I'm like the arrow that springs from the bow. No hesitation, no doubts. The path is clear. And what are you? Alive. Everything else is negotiable. Women have rights; men have responsibilities; MGTOW have freedom. Marriage is for chumps. If someone stands in the way of true justice, you simply walk up behind them and stab them in the heart-R'as al Ghul.

[narwhalParticipant]

When looking at a historical perspective of the classifications of MGTOW, PUA, MRA, Trad-Con and Incel, three of these groups existed before the rise of feminism. Trad-cons were clearly the dominate classification since that’s how most men lived. However, there were still men who had little no appeal as a husband an father, and thus were on the outside looking in. I would guess their numbers have increased a bit with time, but probably not the different as a percentage of the population. And MGTOW have always been. Men who chose to live on their own by their own terms. Modernization has allowed more men to live independently, but I’d say feminism has pushed many who would have opted for trad con without much thought towards MGTOW in much greater numbers.

PUA class are just the type who wish to live in a constant state of immediate gratification. Feminism has changed what that looks like, but you could argue that pre-feminism that type existed as a married man who would cheat given the opportunity, and was a happy to take advantage of a bad situation without concern for impact on others or future implications. Although I would guess the numbers have grown a bit as men hit hard by feminism are more easily pushed in this direction.

MRAs feels like a fight fire with fire type of group. They intend to win men’s rights by the same means women achieved their rights. But women are so much better at it. It’s the equivalent of saying women are as athletic as men by setting up women only professional sports leagues.

Two additional points, it feels like the classifications leave out a huge portion of the male population, everyone else. I’d probably break those into 2 groups, blue pill and purple pill. Blue pill have hopelessly tied into feminism and refuse to look at their lot in life through a logical lens. The purple pill are men who can comprehend logic and what’s going around them, but are held back because they have so much to lose in a marriage, or are just not ready to fully accept that it’s all been a lie.

I also think you can break down MGTOW into 2 basic groups. There are those that are committed to it to death. The current social circumstances are irrelevant as no forgiveness will ever be given. Then there are those that are willing to forget the past and would re-engage if conditions were truly equitable for a relationship. The distinct really isn’t too relevant though, as there is a 0.00001% chance that conditions will ever be equitable.

Ok. Then do it.

[TwistParticipant]

Ranger One wrote:

I concur.

Me too. Thanks BP.

[Author]

Posts