Went for Sushi, Positive MGTOW

[Anonymous 2]

Before I tell about my evening, know that I consider myself a low-level MGTOW that’s aware of female psychology and the legal / financial risks of dealing with women. I also consider myself “lucky” as a European as I hear our American / Canadian brothers have to deal with a lot more gynocentric laws. I do have a GF. I just don’t want to make her my wife and such.

I had a good evening with mate that’s “inherent MGTOW”. Doesn’t know what Red Pill means but we, as friends, always took pride in our self-reliance and seeing through “bulls~~~” of all sorts. Including the feminist variety. We are both over 30 and lead typical bachelor style lives. Throughout our youth we f~~~ed around. Not much, because SMV, but enough to know how women can be are. Would we have had the internet and this site back then, I would probably have been far more angry at women.

But I am not. I’ve had some Red Pill rage in me at the end of 2014 and throughout 2015 but I seem to have lost it completely. I am no longer angry about ANY of this. And tonight, as we compared our current lives with that of people from “way back” I realised something very positive. We dodged a lot of bullets, but we are better off then most of the guys our age.

In a physical sense we already live more comfortably then most of the kings and queens that ever lived. Running water, electricity, heating. At the age of 30 every mans life is a small kingdom in terms of complexity. We men get s~~~ done. Objectives get achieved. And in between our efforts we sleep in kingsize beds. Inviting a women into it… it’s becoming more of a detail then an objective. Intimicy is all I want from a woman. Not a relationship, not a promise, but the mutual exchange of intimicy at zero cost or expectation apart from honesty and common sense. That women can’t be sensible is a gross misunderstanding. Women are conditioned to be obnoxious whores, not born that way.

I posted this in Cool Stuff because it isn’t more then that. Just one guy that has seen his SMV flipped before he got tied down. Went for sushi and drinks with a fellow MGTOW. Had a great evening with excellent company. Wisdom was exchanged. Sometimes I browse these forums and I sense a lot of (entirely understandable) anger. But MGTOW is a POSITIVE FORCE. Beyond the red pill rage lies SUCH TRANQUILITY guys. I may sound like a f~~~ing hippy but I don’t really care as long as I get my message across to young men. You might be angry now, but that’s a temporary mental state. Once your SMV flips and your libido relaxes, the pedestalization of women will be OVER. Immunity to feminist corruption awaits!

[Honorable_Juice_BoxParticipant 591]

Anonymous wrote:

Sometimes I browse these forums and I sense a lot of (entirely understandable) anger. But MGTOW is a POSITIVE FORCE. Beyond the red pill rage lies SUCH TRANQUILITY guys. I may sound like a f~~~ing hippy but I don’t really care as long as I get my message across to young men. You might be angry now, but that’s a temporary mental state

Very true, the red pill rage will pass. At times the forums may seem repetitive, but it’s important to keep dishing out those red pills for reminders and for any new men-bers and lurkers.

[FrostByteParticipant 19005]

Anonymous wrote:

I do have a GF. I just don’t want to make her my wife and such.

You came here to post that?

Anonymous wrote:

That women can’t be sensible is a gross misunderstanding. Women are conditioned to be obnoxious whores, not born that way.

Most of the MGTOW (and myself) seem to follow the constrained vision of female nature. You think hypergamy is learned even though this behavior is well documented for thousands of years.
If you are going to save woman from themselves and society you might ask some White Knights for advice. They know more about saving woman. MGTOW are past that, past caring that we misunderstand them or wanting to understand them.

Anonymous wrote:

I may sound like a f~~~ing hippy but I don’t really care as long as I get my message across to young men.

No you sound more like a tuna (went for sushi title indicates you know that already) and you don’t seem to have message, unless submit to woman is what your trying to say.

If you rescue a damsel in distress, all you will get is a distressed damsel.

[TuneoutParticipant]

Anonymous wrote:

also consider myself “lucky” as a European as I hear our American / Canadian brothers have to deal with a lot more gynocentric laws.

Maybe because I’ve never been married but I’ve always considered my self lucky as Canadian when I hear stories from US,UK and Australia,for a single guy it’s still pretty good here.

Lifes a bitch,but you don't have to marry one!

[Anonymous 18]

Anonymous wrote:

But MGTOW is a POSITIVE FORCE. Beyond the red pill rage lies SUCH TRANQUILITY guys. I may sound like a f~~~ing hippy but I don’t really care as long as I get my message across to young men. You might be angry now, but that’s a temporary mental state. Once your SMV flips and your libido relaxes, the pedestalization of women will be OVER. Immunity to feminist corruption awaits!

You poetically summarized the essence of post-disillusionment from being plugged in the feminine imperative.

I exude masculinity yet get along so much better with men in real life than the female perspective would ever like to admit.

There is no dying alone as an old man if you live a single, unmarried life.

But you will die alone if you marry – EVERY SINGLE DAY you are married to a woman.

[Anonymous 2]

@frostbyte
I merely intended to give context. I might just as well have said “MGTOW Level 0.5”. It means I still engage with women because I am not ignoring my natural impulses. I would advocate controlling them instead. Just a thought but… something that has been documented has been done so in script… which is a sign of society.

These writings are no conclusive evidence women cannot be conditioned otherwise or have hypergamy embedded in their DNA. There is no “saving” women because there is nothing to save women FROM. Society HAS BEEN ACHIEVED and there are no monsters in the woods to protect women from aymore. Father State takes care of that one. Not my concern!

I consider the feminist to be a psychological archetype that has failed natural selection in the light of Red Pill knowledge. Feminist / MGTOW archetypes simply don’t match psychologically and are unlikely to reproduce. This is good, because the world is overpopulated.

@iLearn
Thank you, that was the message I was trying to convey. Post-disillusionment instilled the KNOWLEDGE that I hold most of the cards (assets) to any relationship. It’s no longer a domination/submission battle (although that’s fun in the bedroom no matter who wins) but one of simply choosing to allocate assets or not. This choice in and of itself IS sovereignity.

[FrostByteParticipant 19005]

I still believe the constrained vision is more accurate than the unconstrained vision. TFM does a good debate on this called “MGTOW: A Conflict of Visions” and I side with the idea that hypergamy is hard wired and won’t be changed.

I agree that Feminism (psychological archetype) or in my terms so out there it is a hysteria coming from some seriously ill minds. I do not think all woman are that mentally ill.

Many MGTOW have sexual relations with woman however to HAVE girlfriend is to say she HAS a boyfriend and now ownership in implied and you’re back on the plantation.

If you rescue a damsel in distress, all you will get is a distressed damsel.

[Anonymous 2]

Ownership is implied but not actualized reality. I get what you are saying though. It implies a lot of things and I use the term for loss of a better one, it emphasises some level of emotional investment. I desire intimacy and not just sex.

In truth she signed a contract and in our private little FANTASY and she’s actually my property. Again, implied but not actualized reality. Sovereign human beings cannot own one another, that idea (slavery) is deplorable as a whole.

I’ll watch that video, but some other time. Let’s assume that hypergamy is indeed hardwired. Then so must I be hardwired with behaviours, and I know inherently that behaviour is polygamy. Which makes a whole lot of sense if monogamy was’t the norm. We do not need that construct for our race to reproduce. That requires planning a family for 20 years or so, but does not need to guarantee a monogamous commitment beyond or even during that time. Lose the constraint of monogamy as a norm and you end up with women actively fighting over you. Some will fight dirty and some will still show genuine care. Knowing how to seperate the two has proven INVALUABLE to my happyness as “level 0.5” MGTOW.

[FrostByteParticipant 19005]

Anonymous wrote:

In truth she signed a contract and in our private little FANTASY and she’s actually my property. Again, implied but not actualized reality. Sovereign human beings cannot own one another, that idea (slavery) is deplorable as a whole.

Gorean, BDSM? That I do understand. Thank you for the respectful debate.

If you rescue a damsel in distress, all you will get is a distressed damsel.

[Anonymous 2]

No problem. No Gorean stuff, just some regular D/s. Quite light actually. Mostly bondage, impact play, rough sex… nothing truly viscious or legally dangerous.

[FrostByteParticipant 19005]

Anonymous wrote:

No problem. No Gorean stuff, just some regular D/s. Quite light actually. Mostly bondage, impact play, rough sex… nothing truly viscious or legally dangerous.

I like Gorean because the woman truly wants a strong 24/7 patriarchy, and willing submits to it.
Goreans are hard to find.

If you rescue a damsel in distress, all you will get is a distressed damsel.

[RedRojasParticipant 559]

Anonymous wrote:

Would we have had the internet and this site back then, I would probably have been far more angry at women.

But I am not. I’ve had some Red Pill rage in me at the end of 2014 and throughout 2015 but I seem to have lost it completely. I am no longer angry about ANY of this. And tonight, as we compared our current lives with that of people from “way back” I realised something very positive. We dodged a lot of bullets, but we are better off then most of the guys our age.

When you say “we” do you mean you and your friend? Or all men in general?

Anonymous wrote:

In a physical sense we already live more comfortably then most of the kings and queens that ever lived. Running water, electricity, heating. At the age of 30 every mans life is a small kingdom in terms of complexity.

False. This is not true for “every man.”

Anonymous wrote:

We men get s~~~ done. Objectives get achieved. And in between our efforts we sleep in kingsize beds. Inviting a women into it… it’s becoming more of a detail then an objective.

False. There are many Simps, Manginas, White Knights, and especially PUAs that make getting women to bed their primary objective.

Anonymous wrote:

That women can’t be sensible is a gross misunderstanding.

That sounds like something my feminist sister would say.

Anonymous wrote:

Women are conditioned to be obnoxious whores, not born that way.

Experience from male divorcees as well as an overwhelming majority of MGTOW would beg to differ. Let’s give you the benefit of the doubt and say that they are “conditioned” what’s your point?

Anonymous wrote:

Intimicy is all I want from a woman. Not a relationship, not a promise, but the mutual exchange of intimicy at zero cost or expectation apart from honesty and common sense.

See, this is where you are horribly, horribly wrong. Do not think for one second that if a woman gives you access to her pussy, that she doesn’t want SOMETHING from you in return. In her mind, her granting you access to her pussy IS costing her something and she definitely expects / will be expecting you to do something, buy something, behave in a certain way, etc. If you fail to meet her expectations, guess what, no pussy for you buddy. This is female nature, it’s all about CONTROL.

Anonymous wrote:

I may sound like a f~~~ing hippy but I don’t really care as long as I get my message across to young men.

What “message” is that. Speak plainly.

Anonymous wrote:

You might be angry now, but that’s a temporary mental state. Once your SMV flips and your libido relaxes, the pedestalization of women will be OVER. Immunity to feminist corruption awaits!

What exactly do you propose with this statement?

Consistency is victory - Ultra Magnus

[Anonymous 2]

We too have a 24/7 arrangement but it’s more playfull I guess. We are inventive enough to come up with our own narrative. I prefer to keep that an organic development. We do not live together, nor have plans to.

The existance of Gorean archetypes proves that with so much as a fantasy novel, women can be triggered to romanticize a certain type of relationship that is not suited for some Chad Thunderc~~~. It requires a mature man of some intelligence and proper conduct.

I do think hypergamy still plays a role as this does not exclude looking for a “better” Dominant/Master archetype. However, due to the rarity of these men and the implied (again, not actualy realized) devotion of these women, they have little wiggle room for unfaithfull behaviour. The hamsterwheel gets maintained as well. Dominant archetypes might even go quite far with allowing (sexual) experimentation with other people. More grease.

All of them admit to the following when asked why they are into SM:

It makes me feel calm.
It slows down that hamsterwheel of theirs by a lot.

Sorry for sidetracking into this subject. It has one point though: I am no longer bound by societal constraints as to how I shape my relationships with women. It’s no longer about such labels, but by (quantifyable) allocation of resources. By funneling a small amount to a genuinely interested women I do not have to give up on genuine intimicy entirely. Relationships are in need of better dogma’s, and who else are more suitable for that then our sovereign selves?

[GrumpyParticipant]

Tuneout wrote:

Maybe because I’ve never been married but I’ve always considered my self lucky as Canadian when I hear stories from US, UK and Australia,for a single guy it’s still pretty good here.

Its fairly good at the moment Tuneout, it just gets worse daily.

Every bats~~~ crazy left wing SJW idea from around the world is embraced by our own version of those f~~~tards and somehow gets implemented into Law.
Don’t let the complacency or the lack of actually reporting anything thing other than “fluff” by our socialist media fool you. It is just as bad here as anywhere in the western world.

The stories from around the world about what happens to men gets more attention than the stories about men in Canada for the simple reason of that in the world view, Canada is considered a spectator, not a participant.

There was a time in my life when I gave a fuck. Now you have to pay ME for it

[HitmanParticipant]

I think you can do what you waNt to. ..
I will never marry or cohabitate with a woman again.
Legal issues really kill a good time. .
I’m a very busy guy who has little time to share with anyone.
So if a woman is going to be graced with my presence, She better be appreciative.

[Anonymous 2]

Grumpy wrote:

Every bats~~~ crazy left wing SJW idea from around the world is embraced by our own version of those f~~~tards and somehow gets implemented into Law.

This is also my reason to forfeit marriage and kids. You never know if the government will change the rules of the game later on. They do so constantly over here. So I tend to avoid making any of their rules apply to me. No car ownership. No house ownership. I own as little as possible.

[Anonymous 2]

@redrojas
Please don’t nitpick every sentence, I admit I was indeed grossly generalizing in some statements. Sure, women (again, generalization) want something in return for sex but what that particulair demand is matters more to me then that it is as such. I know it is as such and I am accepting that as FACT. As long as you hold on to your cards (assets) the act of playing them is still a conciouss choice. Just never promise anything big, especially not on paper, and NEVER involve the State. Demand that she trusts you with your OWN assets like a grown man and sees through State, Corporate and Religion.

She must accept her status as something to allocate assets to, instead of somebody allocating assets. It’s that simple. She has her own, has she not, as an independent women? Most women don’t accept that so I do not accept “most women” 😉

Women are not my enemy. I have far greater issues with State, Corporate and Religion, which are responsible for f~~~ing about with the natural order (and creating masses of White Knights and Simps with their “plans for humanity”) in the first place. We are suffering our nature because we do not live in nature here in the West. We live in an artificial concrete narcissist hell. That’s why our women are the most demanding harpies in the first place: they don’t know jack about hardship.

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