The College Dilemma

[FunInTheSunParticipant 8286]

I would encourage any high school graduate to go to college on the following conditions:

1. He/She has a specific career goal.
2. He/She has a genuine interest in a variety of subjects and is willing
to do whatever it takes to complete the assignments given by the instructor.
3. He/She can afford the tuition and other expenses.
4. His/Her occupation will enable him/her to earn enough money to pay back a student loan in ten years or less.
5. He/She has enough TIME to study during the week.

I don’t think a college degree is worth the effort if the occupation pays a modest salary. Prospective students should do a cost analysis to see if their student loan is worth the effort they put into paying it back. For example: I wouldn’t get a loan for $100,000 if my major was Human Relations or Women’s Studies. The best scenario I can see with those majors is: a government job that pays $40,000 a year. If my major was accounting, information systems, mechanical engineering, or business administration, and I had the kind of social network that would give me great leads for job opportunities, I’d consider enrolling in an expensive university. If I didn’t have a lot of money, wealthy/generous relatives, or grants/scholarships, I’d go to a state university during the day and get a part time job at night.

I would recommend that students share the rent with other people if they have limited funds for college. I used to live in a house with three other guys and I spent $400 a month for rent (utilities included). It would cost me about $800 to $1000 per semester (tuition and books) if I took 4 classes at my local community college (sometimes the textbook costs more than the actual class!). If I went to my local state university, it would cost about $5000 per semester to go full time. If I decided to get a bachelor’s degree, I don’t know how I would afford to do it. I would probably get a student loan for about $11,000. I spent a few years taking classes at my local community college and I quit. My mind just burned out. I was getting about 5 hours of sleep each day and spending my days off reading books and writing term papers. It was an endless loop of going to work, going to the library, going to classes, and staying up all night to cram for exams. I hardly had a social life or time for any sort of fun activity. That’s the sacrifice that has to be made to get the classes done. I will consider going back to college in the future, but right now I just don’t care. I’m not in the mood to spend 5 hours a day reading, studying, organizing notes, and writing essays with one inch margins all around—even if it’s worth my effort. Besides, I have a $3000 balance on my student loan that should’ve been paid off 5 years ago—-I kept getting a deferment every other year because I was broke. My annual salary is too much to qualify for a Pell Grant, but just enough to pay for my bills and expenses. My goal for the next year is to get my car fixed and reduce my debt so I can have more money to survive. If I make a serious decision to get a bachelor’s degree in the future, I’d have to have a surplus of money, get a grant, or win some money. Working my way through college would drive me crazy. I admire anyone who’s able to do it.

In conclusion, I believe a college degree is great for one’s career and it opens doors to certain job opportunities. However, if the same salary can be obtained with on-the-job training with certain occupations, I think a college degree isn’t necessary—especially one from the expensive private universities! It’s up to each individual to decide if the cost and personal sacrifice made to obtain a college degree is worth the outcome.

"I saw that there comes a point, in the defeat of any man of virtue, when his own consent is needed for evil to win-and that no manner of injury done to him by others can succeed if he chooses to withhold his consent. I saw that I could put an end to your outrages by pronouncing a single word in my mind. I pronounced it. The word was ‘No.’" (Atlas Shrugged)

[DoinMyOwnThing40Participant 1000]

Agreed. Way too many people these days get their 4 year degree and go into $100,000 or more debt. Only to find out that they will never be able to pay it back. Spending $100,000 on a BA in Criminal Justice or something like that, is just asking for a life of poverty.

Women are parasites. Each and every last one of them.

[Sky-OParticipant 18949]

I’ve noticed a trend in about the last decade regarding the college dilemma:

Anyone that attends a university and has all of their college expenses paid for by their parents, or paid for completely with a scholarship or government financial aid seem to be advocates of pursuing a college degree.

But anyone that has to take out large amounts of loans and finance their own lives while in college as well as the tuition and related expenses seems to wind up with a different attitude about their college degree.

So, when the ‘education’ and the degree do not have to be paid for: “College is really important”

When the entire cost of the ‘education’ and degree has to be paid for, and then after graduating, a more objective and real world perspective is linked to both the experience and piece of paper that was obtained.

Just an observation.

[sidecarParticipant 35850]

@sky-o

How college is paid for is certainly indicative, but it’s not quite so simple as you portray it. It’s been my observation that the ones who pay for their college educations through scholarships that they had to hustle for and earn, many of which are tied to maintaining a certain academic standard at a minimum, and who hold part time jobs while taking classes, and try to keep any student loans to a bare minimum are the ones who value their educations the most and make the most use out of them.

The ones who pay for everything entirely through student loans, on the other hand, are just as bad as the trust fund babies taking a free ride on mommy and daddy. So many of them don’t ever even think about the fact that they will have to pay their loans back, because otherwise they wouldn’t be so eager to go hundreds of thousands of dollars into debt. Then they graduate and try to act all confused and hurt that the mean people who so greedily paid for their educations might want a slight return on their investment.

[FunInTheSunParticipant 8286]

DoinMyOwnThing40 wrote:

Way too many people these days get their 4 year degree and go into 0,000 or more debt.

Dude, I’d rather get a mortgage. At least I’d have a place to get out of the rain. I’ve met some highly educated people who ended up working at Walmart for $8 an hour.

"I saw that there comes a point, in the defeat of any man of virtue, when his own consent is needed for evil to win-and that no manner of injury done to him by others can succeed if he chooses to withhold his consent. I saw that I could put an end to your outrages by pronouncing a single word in my mind. I pronounced it. The word was ‘No.’" (Atlas Shrugged)

[FunInTheSunParticipant 8286]

“When the entire cost of the ‘education’ and degree has to be paid for, and then after graduating, a more objective and real world perspective is linked to both the experience and piece of paper that was obtained.”

What makes me upset about the working world is: once students obtain their degrees, the employers ask them how much work experience they have that’s related to their career choice. Many of these students have no work experience! A person can’t get job experience if they can’t get started working, but try explaining that to the employers who demand 2 to 5 years of work experience. I wish there were more employers that would give college graduates a lucky break.

"I saw that there comes a point, in the defeat of any man of virtue, when his own consent is needed for evil to win-and that no manner of injury done to him by others can succeed if he chooses to withhold his consent. I saw that I could put an end to your outrages by pronouncing a single word in my mind. I pronounced it. The word was ‘No.’" (Atlas Shrugged)

[HitmanParticipant]

f~~~ college ..civil service is job security ..imo

[RoyDalParticipant]

FunInTheSun wrote:

I don’t think a college degree is worth the effort if the occupation pays a modest salary.

A few examples of this:
* The mechanic at the car dealer where Mr/Ms College Degree bought their new car makes more than the top one-percent of their white collar corporate hierarchy.
* The HVAC master technician who fixes the air conditioning in the high rise where Mr/Ms College Degree work, makes far more than they do.
* The truck driver who brings the vegetables to the supermarket where Mr/Ms College Degree shop makes the same money they will after about ten years on the job. Um, all those ten years they are paying off student loans — which they cannot wriggle out of — while the trucker, A/C expert, and auto mechanic are living debt free lives.

FunInTheSun wrote:

Dude, I’d rather get a mortgage.

Yes, yes, and yes again!

Society asks MGTOWs: Why are you not making more tax-slaves?

[Anonymous 29]

Well I did an apprenticeship for 3 years. Worked for another four years after that and saved up to pay my own way for uni in full.
So there is more than one way to skin a cat.
As for the women, they can go back to the kitchens and learn how to f~~~ing cook and I’m not talking about frozen dinners or takeout.
Education only makes them confused and moody.

[NioZenParticipant 856]

Become an autodidact, learn for learning’s sake, for self improvement, for erosion of ignorance, not to gain anything more than knowledge and a little bit of wisdom. You can do that for free and will learn a lot more that the expensive bulls~~~ you find in a secondary education. For vocational specialisms such as medicine, law etc, yes, it’s proscribed route and you don’t have much choice, but doing Geography or Gender Studies or some such crap for the sake of having a degree is an utter waste of time and money and will only help to push you further into debt slavery.

We only dream this bondage. Wake up and let it go. - Vivekananda

[Puffin StuffParticipant 24979]

I spoke with an experienced electrician this summer and he said that electricians top out at 110,000.00 per year. They get paid from day 1 of working and have no student loans.

I once sat down with a fire fighter and compared salaries. As a doctor, my salary didn’t exceed his until I was 55. As a doctor you don’t get paid large salaries until you are out of training at age 30. By 55 he retires on full pension and get’s another job.

Potential students must do this kind of cost analysis before they just default into college and the college loan matrix.

#icethemout; Remember Thomas Ball. He died for your children.

[Cipher HighwindParticipant 1144]

I sincerely regret having wasted so much time with studies in a field that, upon analysis of the labour market, is saturated.

There is a silver lining – the Dept. of Education will never see any of that student loan money again. I will be hosing them through “income based repayment”.

[Author]

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