Home › Forums › Marriage & Divorce › Need advice: Pre-divorce strategy
This topic contains 22 replies, has 15 voices, and was last updated by 
Chuck Wow 2 years, 6 months ago.
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Background
Wife and I are both 48
Been married almost 20 years
Marriage is dead but luckily no arguments or drama
One child that is 16 years old
Reside in California —> lifetime alimony after 10 years of marriageAssets/Finances
Zero debt
currently rent
Sold house last year – 200K proceeds in a money market acct
190K each in retirement accounts – IRA, 457b, and 401K
I have an inheritance IRA (165k) that is not co-mingled
50k in 529 college savings plan
8k in joint checking account
I make 100K/year
She makes 65K/yearObjectives
I want to divorce in two years when child finishes high schoolWould like to avoid/limit alimony – from online calculators my estimate would be $1000/month alimony payment for life. However, I think the wife would re-marry because she cannot be alone and looks decent for her age.
Would like to keep my public pension untouched. We both qualify for pensions at age 50 but mine would be about $2000/month more than hers
Strategy
currently stashing cash each month – not large amounts but enough to get my own placecurrently maxing out both of our retirement accounts (at equal amounts) from the house proceeds
I plan on becoming an expat after the divorce and live in a less expensive country. From my research I can have a nice lifestyle for about 2k/month including health insurance
Questions
Should I secretly retire or force my employer to fire me at age 50 while she continues to work full-time? Income from my pension would then only be $2700/month while her wages would be over $5000/month. Would this eliminate or reduce my alimony obligations? If this would obligate her to pay me alimony, then I could use that for leverage to keep my pension (see below).How can I keep my pension untouched? I would be willing to give her the remaining house sale proceeds, our nicest car (about 15k value), and all furniture/electronics/appliances (estimate 20k value) in exchange for me keeping my entire pension. Our child could have the other car and of course the college savings. I would only want my clothes and cell phone.
If you had to choose, would you prefer to keep the pension untouched or not pay alimony? I’m leaning towards a preference of paying alimony based on my hunch of her re-marrying someday. Living in another country, with a low cost of living, would also offset an alimony payment.
Conclusion
I have a fantasy of getting the divorce handled with a para-legal like my sister did a few years ago. They had all the terms agreed to beforehand which made the process quick and inexpensive. Obviously if my wife goes into attack mode than I would need to hire an attorney. Our communication is almost non-existent at this point so I haven’t discussed anything with her yet.
I am hoping some of you have had similar experiences and could offer advice or other points I need to consider. Thanks for any input!
Anonymous25speak to a lawyer now and take legal advice as to whether you can put your assets into a trust so wifey can’t touch them
My plan is to consult with a divorce attorney in the near future…this thread will help ensure I ask all the important questions. Thanks for mentioning about looking into a trust
Anonymous7I have never been married but I have read enough intros here to know you are on borrowed time.
A question to ask yourself is, at what point does she gain the most by leaving/divorcing you?
It is almost a guarantee that she is planning her exit strategy and part of that strategy will be to take you for everything she can get and leave you a destroyed broken shell of a man.
However, I think the wife would re-marry because she cannot be alone and looks decent for her age.
She doesn’t have to re-marry to accomplish this. She just has to spread her legs. When that no longer works she will get cats and pressure your child for grand-babies.
Lets say you opt to pay life time alimony and you both live for another 30 years….
(30 X 12) X 1000 = 360,000Best of luck to you in whatever you decide.
Aside from the obvious – getting legal advice – discreetly buy gold coins for cash and stash them.
Consult with at least one competent attorney. I would avoid doing anything illegal, imho it is not worth it. Good job – you should be able to come up with a coherent plan within the next two years.
"Women are directly adapted to act as the nurses and educators of our early childhood, for the simple reason that they themselves are childish, foolish, and short-sighted—in a word, are big children all their lives, something intermediate between the child and the man, who is a man in the strict sense of the word. Consider how a young girl will toy day after day with a child, dance with it and sing to it; and then consider what a man, with the very best intentions in the world, could do in her place.” Quote from Arthur Shopenhauer, 17th century philosopher
Definitely get an attorney, and maybe a cpa also. The money you spend on a GOOD attorney is the money you will save over the years of alimony. That will provide you more financial flexibility for you and if your son needs help after high school. You can either pay her or pay an attorney. At least the attorney will work for the money!
Side note: California has lifetime alimony? Wow, that state is being run by feminist and their mangina slaves. Glad I don’t live there.
Like a bird on the wire, like a drunk midnight choir, I have tried in my way to be free.
Question: does your wife have any inkling that you are thinking of a divorce? Or do you have a feeling that your wife is planning on divorcing you? Surprise is everything.
Divorce from your Wife’s perspective
Since your child is 2 years away from being an Adult… her divorcing you early on means the child support money runs out very quickly.
A high probability of divorce would occur when the husband is about 5 years away from retirement and at the height of his earning potential. This would maximize her Alimony payments..The law favors the lower earning spouse when it comes to Alimony. But for it to switch from you being the payer to your wife…I believe it would require a number of years of being unemployed or under employed with a well documented history of being unable to find a comparable job to the one you were fired from….
Legal costs: The cheapest route is an out of court settlement. Get such an agreement notorized, and approved by the courts.
Thanks so far for the replies…consulting with an attorney will definitely happen once I have my specific questions outlined.
In a nutshell, I’m mostly curious about intentionally reducing income, prior to filing for divorce, and what effects (if any) it has on alimony calculations. Does the court only look at current income or look back at a period of time (for example 3 years)?
Liquidate as much as you can. Anything of value must be split. If you sell and spend the money on consumables or bills there is no way she gets half.
If you rescue a damsel in distress, all you will get is a distressed damsel.
Question: does your wife have any inkling that you are thinking of a divorce? Or do you have a feeling that your wife is planning on divorcing you? Surprise is everything.
A few times, when she is upset, the wife will say we should divorce after our child finishes high school. I’m sure she has an inkling I am thinking of divorce, but not actively planning for it.
Divorce from your Wife’s perspective
Since your child is 2 years away from being an Adult… her divorcing you early on means the child support money runs out very quickly.
A high probability of divorce would occur when the husband is about 5 years away from retirement and at the height of his earning potential. This would maximize her Alimony payments..I completely agree with this reasoning. My biggest fear is she quits her job while we are married which would greatly increase alimony payments…she constantly complains about how burned out she is.
The law favors the lower earning spouse when it comes to Alimony. But for it to switch from you being the payer to your wife…I believe it would require a number of years of being unemployed or under employed with a well documented history of being unable to find a comparable job to the one you were fired from….
This is my assumption also and one of the questions I will ask an attorney
Legal costs: The cheapest route is an out of court settlement. Get such an agreement notorized, and approved by the courts.
This would be my preference as well and I’m willing to sweeten the pot with the house proceeds and all of our possessions. There is a psychological aspect when somebody is offered a large amount of cash upfront rather than spread out over time…payments that could be affected by numerous reasons (future income, getting re-married, death/disability of the payor, etc.)
Thank you for the well-thought-out reply…very helpful
Liquidate as much as you can. Anything of value must be split. If you sell and spend the money on consumables or bills there is no way she gets half.
Completely agree and this is the main reason I decided to sell our house last year…didn’t want to be in the position of selling under desperate circumstances (divorce). We have been dollar-cost-averaging some of the proceeds into our retirement accounts (in equal amounts).
Fortunately we don’t have any bills except for rent, utilities, and insurance. We live modestly and would say the combined value of both cars, furniture, electronics, and appliances would be under 40K. She cares more about our possessions than I do so it could be used as possible leverage in negotiations. Besides I won’t need anything, besides clothing and personal items, when I move overseas.
Anonymous43get a lawyer. we are not lawyers
Anonymous43do yourself this little favor
consult with all the lawyers you can. All of them in the county, then the next couple counties. You want to visit a lawyer a day. Collect all the cards write the date on them, and send thank you emails reiterating the conversation you had. print the emails and collect the cards in a binder, with plastic page sleeves.
Keep this safe. When she goes looking for a lawyer, she will find someone you consulted with. When y’all get to court, check her lawyer against your binder…if her lawyer is there, show your lawyer the dated card, and the email. Lawyers love busting other lawyers for infractions, in this case, conflict of interest. By consulting with you, you are technically a client. Can’t represent two sides of the case.
Also you may want to make copies of all financial papers for you and her, account numbers, business accounts, utilities, copies of credit cards and statements. Determine who the card owner is. Somehow maneuver her into being the card owner and run up a bill. Make up a fraud alert story, your numbers are so compromised that she needs to open accounts and you can be on her accounts. Get copies of house and car papers, tax forms for you and her. Pay stubs, tax records, property tax records, all the papers with numbers on them. Make copies, no originals. copies of drivers licenses, passports, anything that shows ownership of anything, big purchases. Save it all in a location you can access, storage closet place. Also keep several changes of work and casual clothing, shoes, also a suit for court. Try to keep a small amount of cash there, under $5000. get a refill cell phone at failmart. Keep it at the storage. This will be for lawyer retainer and apartment deposit. Be creative how you accumulate this little bundle, buy groceries pay with cash, and return it. keep the cash, use discover and get cash back, it becomes a part of the purchase.
Apply for credit cards and have paper sent to the po box. Do not. Do not. Do not!!! apply for a checking account now. Do not do this now. The opening date is printed on the checks. You do not want to appear premeditative in this deal. if you have checks from two years ago, what else do you have hidden away? My c~~~ was busted this way and I ended up with all the secret hidden money.
Apply at bass pro shop, get a Visa there or get a Sears card and have it converted to Master card, Toys R Us has Visa credit cards. you want 2 or 3 cards just in case your shared accounts are closed off to you because you made her the card owner. See how this works… I cheated, before I got married, I had several hundred credit cards, a stupid bar bet, and never told her. You don’t need that much credit, but divorce will be expensive.
Copies of papers, clothing and some cash at the storage. Keep the storage secret. use the po box for billing the credit cards and the storage. Insulate these small things from discovery. Get a po box mailbox etc, ups something like that.
Do you share a car? hmmm you may need a car. find a beater, registration and insurance through the po box. do not keep the keys to the car or keys to the storage on your person, ever. Cops may impound your keys to your house and cars if she divorces you first.
I saved the best for last. This is important. You want to file first. File first, and you are the plaintiff, the one with the complaint. She will be the defendant, the one who allegedly did harm, the criminal. This makes all the difference in the world in court. I filed second, my number was 12 behind the c~~~. the low number wins in this deal, like golf. I filed second, and I was always the defendant, the criminal.
Consult with all the lawyers, have copies of all the papers, transfer ownership of current credit cards to her, get some credit cards of your own, mailbox, storage, maybe a beater car, some cash, your passport, no keys on your person ever, no new checking account until after divorce proceedings start, file first, tell no one about what you are planning. strike hard, get her out of the house. This is war, do not be nice. Do not care what happens to her. No phone calls no emails nothing after the divorce.
Do not fight for furniture or silly little things, just dump it all on her. All of it. Get new s~~~. Give her the house. Let her figure out how to pay for it.
Good luck amigo.
“Need advice: Pre-divorce strategy”
NEVER MARRY.
You’re welcome.
When women lead, destruction is the destination. -- Me.
I was 38 and in Cali when wife left, etc. (16 years married) took a 2 week vacation with our son and didnt return! Hello Chad, I’m here!
I consulted a lawyer and he suggested I leave Cali. (If I filed all the bad things you listed would happen) he recommended a few favorable states….
I accidentally got laid off and found that the only employment was in the state where my folks lived.
Moved to that nice state (No alimony since she worked too and since my new job just happened to pay what hers did wallah) and 6 months later I was a resident. Then I filed.
On my pension my lawyer told me that my ex would have to fill out paperwork, engage, etc, when i came to be age eligible. In my case my ex isn’t very bright plus she remarried. Winning.
Hope this helps.
Please remember that I’m not a lawyer, but I paid one.
Peace brothers
do yourself this little favor
consult with all the lawyers you can. All of them in the county, then the next couple counties. You want to visit a lawyer a day. Collect all the cards write the date on them, and send thank you emails reiterating the conversation you had. print the emails and collect the cards in a binder, with plastic page sleeves.
Keep this safe. When she goes looking for a lawyer, she will find someone you consulted with. When y’all get to court, check her lawyer against your binder…if her lawyer is there, show your lawyer the dated card, and the email. Lawyers love busting other lawyers for infractions, in this case, conflict of interest. By consulting with you, you are technically a client. Can’t represent two sides of the case.
Also you may want to make copies of all financial papers for you and her, account numbers, business accounts, utilities, copies of credit cards and statements. Determine who the card owner is. Somehow maneuver her into being the card owner and run up a bill. Make up a fraud alert story, your numbers are so compromised that she needs to open accounts and you can be on her accounts. Get copies of house and car papers, tax forms for you and her. Pay stubs, tax records, property tax records, all the papers with numbers on them. Make copies, no originals. copies of drivers licenses, passports, anything that shows ownership of anything, big purchases. Save it all in a location you can access, storage closet place. Also keep several changes of work and casual clothing, shoes, also a suit for court. Try to keep a small amount of cash there, under $5000. get a refill cell phone at failmart. Keep it at the storage. This will be for lawyer retainer and apartment deposit. Be creative how you accumulate this little bundle, buy groceries pay with cash, and return it. keep the cash, use discover and get cash back, it becomes a part of the purchase.
Apply for credit cards and have paper sent to the po box. Do not. Do not. Do not!!! apply for a checking account now. Do not do this now. The opening date is printed on the checks. You do not want to appear premeditative in this deal. if you have checks from two years ago, what else do you have hidden away? My c~~~ was busted this way and I ended up with all the secret hidden money.
Apply at bass pro shop, get a Visa there or get a Sears card and have it converted to Master card, Toys R Us has Visa credit cards. you want 2 or 3 cards just in case your shared accounts are closed off to you because you made her the card owner. See how this works… I cheated, before I got married, I had several hundred credit cards, a stupid bar bet, and never told her. You don’t need that much credit, but divorce will be expensive.
Copies of papers, clothing and some cash at the storage. Keep the storage secret. use the po box for billing the credit cards and the storage. Insulate these small things from discovery. Get a po box mailbox etc, ups something like that.
Do you share a car? hmmm you may need a car. find a beater, registration and insurance through the po box. do not keep the keys to the car or keys to the storage on your person, ever. Cops may impound your keys to your house and cars if she divorces you first.
I saved the best for last. This is important. You want to file first. File first, and you are the plaintiff, the one with the complaint. She will be the defendant, the one who allegedly did harm, the criminal. This makes all the difference in the world in court. I filed second, my number was 12 behind the c~~~. the low number wins in this deal, like golf. I filed second, and I was always the defendant, the criminal.
Consult with all the lawyers, have copies of all the papers, transfer ownership of current credit cards to her, get some credit cards of your own, mailbox, storage, maybe a beater car, some cash, your passport, no keys on your person ever, no new checking account until after divorce proceedings start, file first, tell no one about what you are planning. strike hard, get her out of the house. This is war, do not be nice. Do not care what happens to her. No phone calls no emails nothing after the divorce.
Do not fight for furniture or silly little things, just dump it all on her. All of it. Get new s~~~. Give her the house. Let her figure out how to pay for it.
Good luck amigo.
may-7-2020 gets it. My mom was the one who initiated. She took my dad by surprise, and slapped him with a restraining order, had the guns taken, and took every opportunity to f~~~ him over. Don’t wait. Esp if your relationship is already on the rocks. Treat every day as if it’s a day she’s filing and be one step ahead. She even threw a f~~~ on him the night before she had him served at work.
Chuck, while you’ll read plenty of great advice in this thread and one this site, the most important piece of advice is to GET A LAWYER.
Many here have been through divorce with varying outcomes, but none of us here are lawyers.
Get lawyer, make a plan, and realize you are now at war.
The more you sweat in preparation, the less you’ll bleed in combat.
Do not date. Do not impregnate. Do not co-habitate. Above all, do not marry. Reclaim and never again surrender your personal sovereignty.
Start consulting with all the best divorce lawyers in the area. Go to mensdivorce.com and do your research. You’ll read about conflicting out attorneys. This works to your advantage. Good luck.
"Don't follow in my footsteps...I stepped in something."
I was 38 and in Cali when wife left, etc. (16 years married) took a 2 week vacation with our son and didnt return! Hello Chad, I’m here!
I consulted a lawyer and he suggested I leave Cali. (If I filed all the bad things you listed would happen) he recommended a few favorable states….
I accidentally got laid off and found that the only employment was in the state where my folks lived.
Moved to that nice state (No alimony since she worked too and since my new job just happened to pay what hers did wallah) and 6 months later I was a resident. Then I filed.
On my pension my lawyer told me that my ex would have to fill out paperwork, engage, etc, when i came to be age eligible. In my case my ex isn’t very bright plus she remarried. Winning.
Hope this helps.
Please remember that I’m not a lawyer, but I paid one.
Thank you for sharing that…your situation was very similar to what I am facing. I have also thought about relocating to a more favorable state before filing. Anyone familiar with divorce in Nevada when compared to CA?
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