Home › Forums › MGTOW Central › My explanation for why I went MGTOW
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Mr. Spock 7 months ago.
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I will try to explain the experience that leads to MGTOW philosophy and how it is completely rational, not simply a hissy fit as declared by unenlightened programmed observers.
We have to start with the notion of responsibility. What is that for men in the case of relationship formation? An example of not taking responsibility would be to enter into a relationship with a woman where you passively consent to allowing yourself to be manipulated and controlled with the hopes of “doing what she wants so you don’t lose her.” We have to remember that if you allow yourself to be manipulated and controlled you will confront some certain outcomes. These outcomes are a state of depression, a state of deflated self, a state of perceived futility or a state of anger. Sometimes these can all be present at the same time, or alternate in a cycle of self-destructive emotions that wear down your resolve
If you respond in anger at some point, either by throwing a coffee cup, screaming, or God-forbid, physical violence, there will be absolutely ZERO sympathy for whatever triggers or psychological/emotional abuses that wore you down to the point where you acted out in ways that are not your “better self.” The only solution to avoiding this outcome is to develop an awareness of the seeds that lead to this result. If you proceed in a situation where you are being controlled, you consent to a ticking time bomb of loss of self-control. The loss of self-control is a certainty when you consent to being in a situation where another person can control you. It is death by a thousand cuts. As you proceed with the woman in the relationship, the emotional chaos will slowly wear you down over time. Eventually, the accumulation of stress or chaos will remove from you the ability to refrain from showing total disdain and hatred for the person effecting control over you. Therefore, once that is learned, your job is to “man up” so they say, and stop “dating the wrong ones” and “allowing this to happen to yourself.” IE: YOUR FAULT! YOUR FAULT! YOUR FAULT! What’s that you say? My fault? Ok, sure. Let us proceed with this as the assumption. I falsely believed the mantra of society which is that, “it is about love” and that sacrifices for this ideal will be recognized by the woman as “love,” and responded to favorably by her. Shame on me, I was fooled.
Since it is my fault, I have to avoid any woman who displays a red flag that indicates that such outcomes will be likely. This is self-preservation, this is taking responsibility and “manning up.” However, the result of this “manning up” is not what people think. The culture will tell you that if you do such work of maturity, the “right one” comes for you. So what do you do? You enter back into the dating market with your new handbook manual of red flags. Then, what happens is you end up seeing red flags in every situation, and at different times along the road with each individual woman. Some of them will display red flags in the first 2 minutes of conversation, others will display flags a few months in. The more adept you become with your awareness of these red flags, the sooner they appear and the sooner you can force their hand to show them. The result is this: Go down the path, see the sign, walk away, go down the path, see the sign, walk away, go down the path, see the sign, walk away etc. If you report this information of “seeing repeated red flags” back to the collective or people under the blue pill spell, they simply say, “you haven’t found the right one, keep trying.” So then a question has to be asked, “How many dates or pursuits should be enacted before we make a generalized call on the state of affairs with the character of women? 30, 50, 100, 1000?” This is the question that eventually is formed. The response from the collective and culture is this, “Infinity. You must date to infinity and never lose hope. If you make a general call, you have failed and shame on you. Only failures and the mentally unwell ever question finding the right one.” Even if you do due diligence as a man, and pursue 200 women, and walk away 200 times to avoid being controlled, the answer from others is still the same mantra.
This is where mgtow in the advanced level is born. Why? It costs time and stress to constantly go down the path with a woman to only have the red flags appear after investing emotional energy or at the very least, energy of situational tolerance. Mostly, the energy required to deal with a woman is the fortification of your exterior in order to deflect the absorption of chaotic emotions from entering your emotional bloodstream. Once they enter in, you have chaotic poison in your veins that kills the ability to sleep peacefully, the ability to eat without abdominal problems, the ability to enjoy music, and frankly the peace of mind and life itself.
When it comes to pillars and mantras that make up the most sacred illusions and beliefs within human culture, you are not allowed to tie together pieces of information and experiences that paint the general picture and trend of what is truly happening. If you try to attack or expose the sacred pillars, the collective and those under its spell of hope and dreams, will belittle you in an attempt to bring you to your knees. Generally, they hope to make you depressed and doubt yourself for proclaiming what you have seen to be true. This is ONE of the reasons for high male suicide rate. They are the ones who believe they are a useless failure and they are at fault for not being able to solve the unsolvable. They think no one loves them, and they are right. However, don’t let this reality make you want to die. So what if no one loves you. You are witnessing a phenomenon of existence in the human state. You are seeing the kingdom of darkness at work, the same one the greatest minds in history have seen for thousands of years. Now you KNOW what they mean when they wrote down what they saw. The human kingdom is built on lies and darkness and to be aware of this breaks even the strongest of men. It can turn hulks of men into sobbing passive depressives who dream of death and escape.
So what is known at MGTOW philosophy, or redpill, is a breaking away from the “loop of hope” that brings you back to blue pill reset. No matter how many times you do what the collective says and come to the same result, they will tell you to continue in hopes of experiencing a different result. What does this mean? It means the world around you is f~~~ing crazy and you have to save yourself. MAKE THE CALL in your mind. You don’t need to repeat something 2000 times to find a different result. You can trust what you see and experience. It is the stagnant mantras of culture and society that create the mental illness for those with an ability to think and perceive. The world and society around you is telling you to repeat the same thing and expect a different result. If you point this fatal flaw out, they will emotionally punish you. Women will also do this, as they are a voice of cultural command.
If you handle a poisonous snake 20 times in a row and each time it bites you, you get sick and nearly die, do you need to do it again? If you avoid doing it again does it mean you hate rattlesnakes because you are simply bitter? You see what I mean. Once you choose self-preservation over fruitless and pointless sacrifice, you are, as a man, seen as WAY out of line. In order to get to this point, you have to commit apostasy, that is, to make a GENERALIZED call based on REPEATED experiences. They insist that making generalizations is faulty because they want you to believe that repeating the same thing again and again will lead to a result other than what obviously happens again and again.
That is the true insanity we live in. The decision to hit the eject button and make the call on what is happening, is completely rational and sane. However, in this world, that itself is considered insane.
What are you thoughts on this analysis?
I have been MGTOW since 2014 and there are many layers to the maturity that occurs with red pill knowledge.“How many pursuits should be enacted before we make a generalized call on the state of affairs with the character of women? 30, 50, 100, 1000?” ….. The response from the collective and culture is this, “Infinity. You must date to infinity and never lose hope.
Straight up truth. As Stardusk said, “It is YOUR fault, you (being the man) keep choosing the wrong woman… Never, I repeat never, is their an explanation for how women act.” (something like that, straight out of Stardusk Compilation, pure Gold).
As Barbarossa said, (after awhile of dating women) “Its like there is a factory somewhere, cranking out copies of these women, theyre all the same version.” (paraphrased Barbar and Stardusk).
there are many layers to the maturity that occurs with red pill knowledge.
I concur. I went through MANY phases of wrapping my head around this. The reason its layered is because this isnt only Knowledge we’re absorbing. Its knowledge that has a profound impact on your emotions. It isnt Internalized on the first go-around. Its also not limited to online reading and online content absorption, this crap is apparent in your REAL life. It hits home and shakes you to the core over and over again until you truly understand.
I agree to everything you said and the general theme which is that INSANITY is repeating the same behavior (getting burned in relationsh!ts over and over) and expecting a different result. Only a complete ignoramus would continue banging his head on a wall trying to relieve a headache.
I was first red pilled around 2008. That is, the first version of the red pill where you realize “something more is going on here.” It took ten years of being in and outside of relations~~~s to fully get it. I had to both abstain aggressively, pursue aggressively, go monk, then go back and pursue, then I finally understood. The experiences shape your emotions. You can’t just decide not to care and have your emotions obey. You need to emotionally experience this s~~~ in waves in order to finally have them not react the same way that puts you at their mercy.
Eventually, the tendency to listen to the “dream” part of the brain gets short circuited. You end up seeing t~~~, seeing the sex in your mind for a brief second, and then it dissolves. I can no longer willfully lose myself in the impulse.
More thoughts:
After first encountering red pill knowledge, there is a tendency to try and return to the dating world to have sex or fun. The idea is that knowing about it can protect you from it.. not really, that is if you get too close. Women communicate to us men using underhanded energy that comes out of the abdomen and literally wraps around your mind and heart like a clamp. They use words that carry emotional assumptions that create feelings that are hard to remove from your body.
Once these feelings are in your body you can’t enjoy your own life in peace without going through a process of disentanglement. While you are entangled, the stress you experience alone funnels energy to the woman who sprung the mental emotional trap.
Thoughts on PUA and doing self-damage to emotions in order to “win” by not caring with women:
Pick-up artists and “game” is essentially teaching men how to invite problems into their life. There is a neo-masculinity movement that asserts “not caring” as the goal to achieve when it comes to emotional stasis. They preach a hammering of one’s own emotions with a mallet in order to “not feel” the grief or frustration of dealing with female manipulation while trying to pursue them for sex.
Achieving a state of “uncaring” is not victory. It is truly accepting that they don’t care, that is the true victory.
The same emotions that feel pain and grief, are the same emotions that feel the beauty and gift of life. They are the same emotions that enable you to enjoy a piece of music, to see beauty in the world around you, and to feel joy. To practice deliberate stoicism for the singular purpose of “being ready to not care when a woman f~~~s with you” is destructive to the male soul.
In addition, practicing “game” or “pick-up artistry” radically increases your chances of being caught up in a false allegation. Women only give sex if they think you are under the spell, or open enough to be put under the spell. If you use “game” or “pick up deceit” to fool them, and then dismiss them with the sudden paradigm shift that announces that the female never had control, you can very well end up in court or in jail. They hate losing control and will hate you if cause them to feel that.
That’s the reality.
I think Im still susceptible to a vagina relapse, like a meaningful longlasting one, not just a fling. Having been absent any sexual intercourse for many years, and only aged 33 currently, Im entering a period in my manhood where Im already noticing their eyes studying me. They already sense Im fvckable but they are appraising my value to see if Im worth their pouncing. Im not sure how much of, dangling a wet puXXy in my face, I can take before I lose my resolve. Im probably destined for another lesson. Hopefully I dont fully descend into hell.
I was lucky in many respects to have found MGTOW on Youtube back then when I was 27. The only reason I was on Youtube was because I liked watching debates between Xtians and Atheists back in 2012. It was a fun passtime to troll Christians in the comment section of these channels, that’s where I first remember seeing the MGTOW acronym and not caring enough to figure out what it meant. Then I saw it again, and again, and finally stumbled across a Karen Straughn video and a Sandman video (he had just started his channel). A month later I found the Stardusk Compilation and it was pretty much like reading the New Testament, I WAS SAVED.
I only ever knew the treachery of a single mom I dated for about 9 months, a couple years before then. I lived with her. She got pregnant with my kid, miscarried and threw me away like a disguarded piece of toilet paper. I was devastated. I simply could not comprehend her total betrayal and she showed no conscious. It was remorseless and I could not ‘get’ that. How could someone Ice someone like that who loved them?!
I carried on soliciting the love of a few women but came up disgusted by the number of previous sexual partners they’d had. How could they have slept with so many men? Thats when it first hit me that these women dont deserve me, not the other way around! And its VERY true today. Im not a 10 and Im not wealthy. But Im sure as hell not going to be paired with some flap-gaped airhead woman who has been on vacation since 18 and has boned scores of men. Forget that. I have grown some self respect since I was a boy.
I accepted the facts, instead of emotionally trying to wish them away. Neo was promised the truth, nothing else. If you cant handle the truth of the Matrix, go back for more illusions and pain, trade back your “lonliness” for “validation” anytime you want. It only costs you EVERYTHING.
How could someone Ice someone like that who loved them?!
This was the hardest question to let go of, to answer honestly and put to rest. I made the mistake of trying to enlighten many of my exes by writing lengthy essays explaining the foundations of morality when it comes to valuing the feelings of another person. I would write some pretty f*((king impressively worded essays on the logical breakdown of “how she showed no concern for what another feels” and then provide a rational basis for the foundation of caring for another person. All, a waste of time.
In essence, trying to educate them on what it means to love or care is seen by them as a form of begging, or ultimately rubbish nuisance that they don’t want to hear.
As for vagina relapse, the fear of having an unplanned pregnancy always made vaginal sex stressful. I mean, once the wiener goes in, the economics professor demon starts shouting in my ear that I can’t afford the outcome. So, what I did, was avoid vaginal as much as possible and go for anyone who would provide fellatio without needing me to kiss them. Every time I messed up and launched custard into the cavern, I would have a 28 day stress meltdown. I eventually had little to no desire to have vaginal sex, except with the most outstandingly hip-shaped women, which I wasn’t rich enough to get anyway, so I just would search for any woman without coldsores on her lips to provide fellatio without forcing me to kiss her which grosses me out.
Basically, I find very few women truly attractive enough to engage in vaginal sex with. However, when it comes to fellatio, mostly anything goes. The problem is usually that they want you to kiss them or have sex with them as part of fellatio, which is a no go for me. I find it gross and disgusting. I am not interested in dancing around these outstanding physical specimens like a servant with a ukulele and a tray of grapes. It seemed like so much trouble, that the stress itself would make my custard blaster fall over.
there is a tendency to try and return to the dating world to have sex … The idea is that knowing about it can protect you from it.. not really,
yup, that is certainly a lie we tell ourselves. We’re no more safe than before if we’re honest about it. I think Messenger Rising used to nail that home for me.
Achieving a state of “uncaring” is not victory. It is truly accepting that they don’t care, that is the true victory.
PUAs want desperately to be Chads. But Chads naturally get laid without struggle or payment.
I do not believe the PUA tactics work. You either have the charisma and youre a Chad, or your are not and you are being manipulated. PUA is a self-delusion.To practice deliberate stoicism for the singular purpose of “being ready to not care when a woman f~~~s with you” is destructive to the male soul.
That is fvcking DEEP thoughts man. Wow. That is humility and self-honesty right there.
Women only give sex if they think you are under the spell, or open enough to be put under the spell. …. They hate losing control and will hate you if cause them to feel that.
Yup. You cant teach yourself to fake being under their spell. Either you’re a Chad/alpha who gets it for free or you are a woman’s Prey, one or the other. Women have 6 million year old instincts that see right through your “game.” She knows.
MGTOW conclusion and truth: Women will only have a relationship with you if you consent to giving them control over your life. If you force their hand early by stating that you will not consent to this, they call off the courtship.
If you reveal that you are not inside the dream thinking that will consent to being controlled, they will not engage in sex and courtship. Why? Because they only invest in the courtship with sex if they are certain the man is a believer and will consent to being controlled.
I believe that society forbids generalizations in order to hide truths that it does not want people to confront.
I like what you said, about not wanting to kiss women (if I read that right). I like kissing women but I take issue with the fact that none of them seem to know how to kiss. Which is absurd seeing how many partners theyve had, compared with the very limited number I have had.
Youd think theyd be sensual pros at kissing. This is a dead giveaway (now that I think about it) that women have no emotional depth or love. They cant kiss! Theyve had twice to three times the amount of Kissing Experience than Ive had… yet they try to take your face off when you lock lips!
Seriously. Think about it. Everytime a woman kissed you. It was like she was Mimicking some movie or TV show she saw. She kisses you like some robot, spinning her tongue like a propeller in your mouth or other fvcking weird things they do which are NOT romantic or sensual AT ALL! They have no soul to it. They will bite you or spit all over you. Or they go limp as if they expect you to puppeteer their body and mouth. Come to think of it, Women have no sexuality or passion at all. Just like with sports or other hand-eye coordination tasks, they suck at sex and kissing! LOL
I like what you said, about not wanting to kiss women (if I read that right). I like kissing women but I take issue with the fact that none of them seem to know how to kiss. Which is absurd seeing how many partners theyve had, compared with the very limited number I have had.
Youd think theyd be sensual pros at kissing. This is a dead giveaway (now that I think about it) that women have no emotional depth or love. They cant kiss! Theyve had twice to three times the amount of Kissing Experience than Ive had… yet they try to take your face off when you lock lips!
Seriously. Think about it. Everytime a woman kissed you. It was like she was Mimicking some movie or TV show she saw. She kisses you like some robot, spinning her tongue like a propeller in your mouth or other fvcking weird things they do which are NOT romantic or sensual AT ALL! They have no soul to it. They will bite you or spit all over you. Or they go limp as if they expect you to puppeteer their body and mouth. Come to think of it, Women have no sexuality or passion at all. Just like with sports or other hand-eye coordination tasks, they suck at sex and kissing! LOLPerhaps I have been lucky in that department as my last two lovers were great kissers. They’re (upstairs) lips were a decadent delight to my hairy ones!
I will try to explain the experience that leads to MGTOW philosophy and how it is completely rational, not simply a hissy fit as declared by unenlightened programmed observers.
No need to have to defend YOUR CHOICES to others.
THEY’LL Never Understand Anyways.
So much easier to walk away grinning and laughing….
In a World of Justin Beibers Be a Johnny Cash
She kisses you like some robot, spinning her tongue like a propeller in your mouth
This just propelled a Tito’s and soda right through my nose.
Thank you.
I’ve know the propeller. And wondered what the F she was on about…
“the propeller” hahahahahaha! An apt description. The woman I’m plowing, for the moment, does this. I’ve had some that have occasionally done it, but never encountered it to such an annoyingly exaggerated degree.
On the subject of Red Flags, I am now encountering this classic farce.
Her: We never do anything. You always just want to hang out, it’s like your 80 or something.
Me: Ok, fair enough, what would you like to do?
Her: I have no idea….
And needless to say, like clockwork, it has been the anecdotally known predictable three month mark she starts this s~~~…time to punt her.Sovereignty above all else.
Nominate for “top gun” if we still have it
The “propeller” should only be used on the head of the penis and no other place.
Her: We never do anything. You always just want to hang out, it’s like your 80 or something.
Me: Ok, fair enough, what would you like to do?
Her: I have no idea….Most of them can’t enjoy being with someone unless it is tied to the sphere of social activity. A woman’s entire self is made up of group social activity cues. Their self-identity is a creation that only exists in proximity to a hierarchy sorting out its dominance and make-believe rubbish. If you separate them from a hierarchy social setting, they feel out of touch with the source of their identity.
Anonymous3Her: We never do anything. You always just want to hang out, it’s like your 80 or something.
Me: Ok, fair enough, what would you like to do?
Her: I have no idea…Essentially she implying “I am unhappy”. When you replied to what she really said, she shrugged of as “its your job to KNOW how to make me happy”.
And as we all know, women can never be happy.Yep, downhill from this moment forward…
Her: We never do anything. You always just want to hang out, it’s like your 80 or something.Me: Ok, fair enough, what would you like to do?Her: I have no idea….
Most of them can’t enjoy being with someone unless it is tied to the sphere of social activity. A woman’s entire self is made up of group social activity cues. Their self-identity is a creation that only exists in proximity to a hierarchy sorting out its dominance and make-believe rubbish. If you separate them from a hierarchy social setting, they feel out of touch with the source of their identity.
Agreed on all points. They have some genetic programming from ancient times, which they are incapable of releasing, that is ironically not compatible within the context of how they wish to fit into modern society. I’m enjoying reading your perspectives, much like psychologist minus the gynocentric brainwashing they all have.
Sovereignty above all else.
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