Home › Forums › MGTOW Central › I'm torn between honor and passion.
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JVB 3 years, 1 month ago.
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I sense that I have two choices at this stage in my life. Honor and passion. Some may refer to them as good and evil.
With my now, unique understanding of female nature, it is tempting to play with fire. I am young, attractive, horny, and sterile. However, I understand the female animal’s games and tactics of manipulation. It is so tempting to carefully explore the minefield of pumping and dumping. No commitments.
On the other end of the spectrum, I see honor. Marcus Aurelius said “Do wrong to thyself, do wrong to thyself, my soul; but thou wilt no longer have the opportunity of honoring thyself.” Will I lose self respect by treating women like sexual utilities much like they treat men as financial utilities? Wouldn’t that place me on the same, pathetic level? I would be slutting around for temporary pleasure just as they.
My biology is f~~~ing with my head.
I would appreciate your input brothers.
Pursuing Happiness and Freedom.
Anonymous42Honor has little to do with it, where’s your logic? That’s the radio frequency you want to tune into! LOGIC.
Does she have a nasty disease?
Logic: Gee there’s raging sexual revolution with 50% of the population infected with who knows what, swapping bodily fluids and risking touch contamination is like licking a dirty dumpster.
Conclusion: Illogical.Follow your LOGIC without skipping a beat and youy’ll find yourself free of all confusion.
Follow your logic and you’ll be free of life draining people that are only good for a case of depression.
I got over the sexual revolution and live in harmony and peace with myself and myself alone.
Add the fact that things have only gotten progressively worse in this sea of endless discord and strife and anyone with an ounce of logic will see it’s a no-brainer.
Step out of the garbage can and all the rancid odor goes away seemingly forever…
007, did that, came to conclusion not worth the effort.
I’m not and have never been a physically attractive guy, which meant beta- / omega- boy for more than 40 years.
When I started to learn about red-pill and MGTOW and stuff, I was already living in seperation from the 15 years elder single-mom, whom I happened to have married 14 years earlier. Being a nice Beta provider, podesting women in general (result of being raised by mom, grandma and sis). All that s~~~, you name it, I’ve done it.Once I went through the worst part of the red pill rage phase, it appeared to me, since I’m a very social person in general, going full Monk mode, can’t be my way.
But isn’t MGTOW all about going your own way? Telling everyone who wants to push you – a whole-hearted ZFG!And man! Did my life change. While it hasn’t been uncommon for me to escort women home – just to pay for the taxi and be then turned down at the door, with some “Oh, you are just such a good friend!” BS, nowadays women start recognizing me. Me? a middle-aged, divorced, balding and obese man? Damn! this for sure felt good, I have had quite some good times, f~~~ing whoever wanted to bend over (8 women between 16 years younger to 4 years older within the last 12 month). This might not impress the “chads” around here, but for me that is a really impressive score.
MY conclusion: The more of a red-pill asshole I became, the more “success” I would have. So I decided, I would have to dig into this thing deeper. And I started to observe people in my personal surrounding for signs of what I had learned. And it worked! perfectly! among my closer aquaintences I have, single moms, one of them dating a typical “chad”-Bull-Alpha, being sorounded by an Omega-Orbiter, Wolf-Alphas, Bear-Alphas, lots of Betas, a Sigma …
While red-pill gave me insight in motivations of the people I knew for years, along came the downturn. The more I learned to observe and analyse people, the more disgusted i became with women. By their ignorance, stupidity and malicious selfish behaviour.
After about 3 years now, I have made peace with it, not chasing pussy anymore, enjoying a good night at the cinemas, theatre or pub (I do like music, especially when played “live”).
Women do appear, but more often than not, I don’t make any efforts anymore.So that’s my story (so far), you’ll have to write your own.
When you go with Aurelius, go with Kant as well: “Act only according to that maxim whereby you can, at the same time, will that it should become a universal law.”
In other words: Would the world be a better place, if everybody does as you are doing?Given every human has dignity and thereby honor, does it dishonor you when you have sex? No! A world where everybody does have Sex, is a happy world.
Does it dishonor you, when you take advantage of your knowledge? No! a world where everybody uses all of his knowledge, talent and ability is a productive world, nothing negative with that.
Does tricking a woman into having sex with you, claiming you would have a coresponding aim in life, while actually you don’t? – Yes! a world where everybody cheats and lies for personal gain, where all selflessness and honesty is completely abolished, would be a horrible place to be in.
Your question is, should you go for honor or passion? I’d say, Honor and Passion do not exclude each other, when handled with care.
"Him, who delights in solitude, is either a wild beast or a GOD!" - Aristotle (Aristot. Pol. 1.1253a) 1 Hom. Il. 9.63; the passage goes on: ἐστὶν ἐκεῖνος ι ὃς πολέμου ἔραται.
Anonymous11Will I lose self respect by treating women like sexual utilities much like they treat men as financial utilities?
No, you will not lose honor. However, you just may end up with a little bit more than you ever bargained for in the first place. The passion is strong when we are young. It’s a powerful potentially destructive force. Treat it with the respect it deserves, and you will always have honor.
I think every MGTOW does go thru this stage honour or passion. For me honour wins every time.
I’ll give you an example of what I mean. A few nights ago I noticed this nurse at work but never seen her body in full view. She was going to get something for a patient.
She had a nice booty. I noticed but it wasn’t like I turned my head to stare at it. I was in eye view and she was walking in front of me.
This person has always said hi to me and I’ve said hi back.
This time she just smiled kind of shy and went on by her business.I thought she was attractive but that’s when the mathematical calculator went on and it said the odds of her being different is not likely. I know that she is probably the same as other women.
Then after I totally forgot about her. There was nothing about maybe I should go up to her. There was no anxiety of thinking maybe I should say something clever. Nothing.
Before when I was in the blue pill world I would think oh I have to talk to her or say something.
Now I say nothing and leave it at that.
We are all going to see someone we are attracted too but you have to be realistic. You can’t just throw away your beliefs for a hot piece of strange as Terrence Popp would say.
It gets easier as you get older. I’m not sure of your age but I’m 45 and with me no kids and never been married.
I know women’s main objective is hypergamy and having a backup plan. That’s the thing you have to remember. Yes there is exceptions to the rule but they are lottery winners also and the chances are that the lottery winner is not going to be you.
Remember that!
007, did that, came to conclusion not worth the effort.
I’m not and have never been a physically attractive guy, which meant beta- / omega- boy for more than 40 years.
When I started to learn about red-pill and MGTOW and stuff, I was already living in seperation from the 15 years elder single-mom, whom I happened to have married 14 years earlier. Being a nice Beta provider, podesting women in general (result of being raised by mom, grandma and sis). All that s~~~, you name it, I’ve done it.Once I went through the worst part of the red pill rage phase, it appeared to me, since I’m a very social person in general, going full Monk mode, can’t be my way.
But isn’t MGTOW all about going your own way? Telling everyone who wants to push you – a whole-hearted ZFG!And man! Did my life change. While it hasn’t been uncommon for me to escort women home – just to pay for the taxi and be then turned down at the door, with some “Oh, you are just such a good friend!” BS, nowadays women start recognizing me. Me? a middle-aged, divorced, balding and obese man? Damn! this for sure felt good, I have had quite some good times, f~~~ing whoever wanted to bend over (8 women between 16 years younger to 4 years older within the last 12 month). This might not impress the “chads” around here, but for me that is a really impressive score.
MY conclusion: The more of a red-pill asshole I became, the more “success” I would have. So I decided, I would have to dig into this thing deeper. And I started to observe people in my personal surrounding for signs of what I had learned. And it worked! perfectly! among my closer aquaintences I have, single moms, one of them dating a typical “chad”-Bull-Alpha, being sorounded by an Omega-Orbiter, Wolf-Alphas, Bear-Alphas, lots of Betas, a Sigma …
While red-pill gave me insight in motivations of the people I knew for years, along came the downturn. The more I learned to observe and analyse people, the more disgusted i became with women. By their ignorance, stupidity and malicious selfish behaviour.
After about 3 years now, I have made peace with it, not chasing pussy anymore, enjoying a good night at the cinemas, theatre or pub (I do like music, especially when played “live”).
Women do appear, but more often than not, I don’t make any efforts anymore.So that’s my story (so far), you’ll have to write your own.
When you go with Aurelius, go with Kant as well: “Act only according to that maxim whereby you can, at the same time, will that it should become a universal law.”
In other words: Would the world be a better place, if everybody does as you are doing?Given every human has dignity and thereby honor, does it dishonor you when you have sex? No! A world where everybody does have Sex, is a happy world.
Does it dishonor you, when you take advantage of your knowledge? No! a world where everybody uses all of his knowledge, talent and ability is a productive world, nothing negative with that.
Does tricking a woman into having sex with you, claiming you would have a coresponding aim in life, while actually you don’t? – Yes! a world where everybody cheats and lies for personal gain, where all selflessness and honesty is completely abolished, would be a horrible place to be in.
Your question is, should you go for honor or passion? I’d say, Honor and Passion do not exclude each other, when handled with care.
Great post! I have actually read Marcus Aurelius’s book “Meditations” like three times myself. Also, for immanuel kant, there is a good book on ethics that Kant wrote called “the critique of practical reason”, but it can be a really difficult read, even for a person with a PHD in English, because immanuel kant himself tends to invent his own words to help him describe what he has to say, since his ideas tend to be really complex that he has to.
"Question everything" - Albert Einstein
Honor.
Honor first/foremost, then consider that perhaps honor and passion are not necessarily mutually exclusive.
"It seems like there's times a body gets struck down so low, there ain't a power on earth that can ever bring him up again. Seems like something inside dies so he don't even want to get up again. But he does."
Oh boy . Our young 007 heading for trouble again .
Just stay away from c~~~ monsters .
A f~~~ed up looking vagina fixed ya unky blade. Hope it happens to you . The vag that f~~~ed me up bro looked like that hand thing that shot out of that egg in the movie ALIEN. I went down to lick her c~~~ and never went there just ran my tongue straight back up her stomach. I will never forget that vag . It has scared me .
THE PLANTATION HAS NOW TURNED INTO THE KILLING FIELDS . WOMAN ARE NOW ROLLING CAMBODIAN STYLE .
Kant wrote called “the critique of practical reason”, but it can be a really difficult read, even for a person with a PHD in English, because immanuel kant himself tends to invent his own words to help him describe what he has to say, since his ideas tend to be really complex that he has to.
Thanks Bro’, I totally agree, Kant ain’t easy, but wisdom is worth the effort (while pussy is not).
"Him, who delights in solitude, is either a wild beast or a GOD!" - Aristotle (Aristot. Pol. 1.1253a) 1 Hom. Il. 9.63; the passage goes on: ἐστὶν ἐκεῖνος ι ὃς πολέμου ἔραται.
Honor and passion are not mutually exclusive. Why do you feel the NEED to categorize, label, and then ATTEMPT to adhere to either one or the other ?
Why don’t you ALLOW yourself to do what you WANT, as you Want ?
I don’t get why so many Men TRY to be self-limiting in such black and white terms ?
Then when they can’t stick to either extreme, it’s often scrapped in favor of another extreme.
You are a young man, why don’t you just try living your life, without self-imposed sexual limitations, but with your red pill knowledge/attitude fully intact ?
In a World of Justin Beibers Be a Johnny Cash
Honor.
Honor first/foremost, then consider that perhaps honor and passion are not necessarily mutually exclusive.
Agreed, as long as you are honest with the women and let them know there can be no marriage you keep your honor. They probably won’t be honest with you but that’s to be expected.
But when you get older the cons of stds, emotional involvement and less time with hobbies it’s best to keep female involvement to a bare minimum.
007 you have said you are training for a sport in the past. Keep in mind by involving women in your life, this will distract you from your goal.
"what a waste of a life, to marry, give up your freedom, just for the hope of not dying alone. Don't get married Son."
Honor and passion are not mutually exclusive. Why do you feel the NEED to categorize, label, and then ATTEMPT to adhere to either one or the other ?
Why don’t you ALLOW yourself to do what you WANT, as you Want ?
I don’t get why so many Men TRY to be self-limiting in such black and white terms ?
Then when they can’t stick to either extreme, it’s often scrapped in favor of another extreme.
You are a young man, why don’t you just try living your life, without self-imposed sexual limitations, but with your red pill knowledge/attitude fully intact ?
I agree, you only need to have honor for yourself. In this f~~~ed up world you and only you have the best interests for yourself. If sex is available on your way, on your terms and it is safe, then go for it. But don’t think that will make you happy.
If it costs you your peace of mind, then it is too expensive.
Honor.
Honor first/foremost, then consider that perhaps honor and passion are not necessarily mutually exclusive.
Agreed, as long as you are honest with the women and let them know there can be no marriage you keep your honor. They probably won’t be honest with you but that’s to be expected.
But when you get older the cons of stds, emotional involvement and less time with hobbies it’s best to keep female involvement to a bare minimum.
007 you have said you are training for a sport in the past. Keep in mind by involving women in your life, this will distract you from your goal.
Thank you for the accurate clarification!
Honor is better than in her.
Still effing laughing. Can’t you see that………… comedy does de-fuse all tension!
"It seems like there's times a body gets struck down so low, there ain't a power on earth that can ever bring him up again. Seems like something inside dies so he don't even want to get up again. But he does."
Tried to shack up for 4 years, got burnt, been there, done that. Time to move on I say, sex is the only thing women can provide and they’re not even good at it, forget intimacy or love, these wretched beasts do not even understand the meaning of these words.
Choose honour.
Behind every miserable man there is a very happy woman.
Honor or Passion? I believe true Men have both! They interweave who we are or want to be.
Passion is our Drive and Intent, our core feeling about what we do, what we believe. Passion gives us the depth to our values.
Honor is ‘How’ we go about it. It is our own personal code for how we conduct ourselves in the pursuit of what we are Passionate about. Both are required and are in our daily journey of life. As we grow as Men it is because both Honor and Passion have grown in us, and our life experiences are there to show us ‘Why’ we’re passionate about these truths and give proof and purpose to owning them!
Whether its what we read, or groups, organizations we belong to, Sports and life in general, learning and growing in both Honor and Passion gives us Purpose! No person or society can ever take away!Meditating on the Wisdom & Truths of Man, Isn't just a Philosophy, but a Calling......Be willing to be Called a Man!Thanks for the boost guys. I had gone a couple days without using my fleshlight so my hormones were interfering with cognition. All is well now.
Pursuing Happiness and Freedom.
You’re young you say. Ok I will guarantee you in 20 years from now you will have wished for the pump n dump.
Peace is > piece.
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