High education/skills is not the skills needed tomorrow

[KillmandrillParticipant 497]

Like a lot of posters said, manual skills are always a good thing to have, be it repairing cars, welding, maintain/repair/build stuff in general. The good thing is you can achieve that aside of studying or in addition.
I´d be like handicapped without my manual/technical/combinatory….skills, and that pinch of social skills just does it.

Faust For Science wrote:

Do you know how use a gun and rifle? Do you know how to hunt, kill, and field-dress an animal? Do you know how create fire-pit, with a grill, to start a fire, and properly cook that animal?

Good points, those are useful skills, trapping maybe if you don´t have a gun, where to find water, knowing nature, orientation w/o compass, first aid and so on, even if civilization does not collapse.

Rules wrote:

Skills needed in the future are interpersonal skills and physical attractiveness which affects your social skills very much.

Social skills are needed of course, but I doubt they are affected by physical attractiveness, rather your personality in general affects your social skills, like how you present yourself.

If you look at politicians you´ll get what I mean!

There´s a proverb in German you can´t translate it: “Handwerk hat goldenen Boden” but what comes pretty close is: “A trade in hand finds gold in every land.”

Ah, women. They make the highs higher and the lows more frequent. Friedrich Nietzsche

[AnthonyParticipant 2281]

Anonymous wrote:

I couldn’t handle the ick factor of Biology as I’m squeamish so I never considered med school.

I’d of gone into med school if it weren’t for the fact I’m squeamish as well.

I can handle certain things like butchering some animals or cleaning fish, but with the medical field, you’ll always end up encountering something even nastier than before. At least with things like hunting, fishing, and farming, things are pretty static as far as the ick factor goes.

Once you have a Fleshlight real vaginas become worthless.

[StargazerParticipant 12505]

Anonymous wrote:

Eyeswideopen wrote:

The world is full of starving genius’

Tesla at his death is the penultimate example.

Tesla died in obscurity not because of lack of knowledge or of education but because of his own arrogance, lack of social skill and p~~~ poor business acumen.

[EyeswideopenParticipant 2930]

Stargazer wrote:

For me, I always tell people “Do what you can so you can do what you want.” Start with the law of competitive advantage and figure out what youre really good at then do that thing for money. With the money you earn, take up the hobbies that you like and if one of them presents an opportunity for making money that doesnt threaten your base income, go for it.

Very well stated. You did a better job at expressing the idea then I did. I am not a wordsmith unfortunately. Everything is shorthand in my world — and I live up to the stereotype my penmanship is atrocious and my spelling is almost as bad.

Anonymous wrote:

couldn’t handle the ick factor of Biology as I’m squeamish so I never considered med school. What I do is analogous to what a physician does. I diagnose and implement remedies for complex issues that effect enterprise IT systems. That STEM degree is so valuable to me as it taught me how to explore the unknown due to my research experience.

I’m ok with the ick factor. Dissecting cadavers beat that out of me. My engineering background helped me disassociate a lot – blood is oil, the heart is a pump etc. When you break the body down to simple machines it makes everything so much easier. In residency, you could tell those that took the proverbial basket weaving 101 to inflate their marks, and those with a STEM background.

I know I might catch a lot of flak for the next statement from the other physicians on this board, but what I do has a lot in common with trades and IT. Diagnosing aspects of IT and the hands-on aspect of trades with a dash of interpersonal skills – like I stated prior, I am pragmatic.

- Marriage is described as an institution. You would have to be crazy to be commited to it. -"If you want to live a happy life, tie it to a goal. Not people or things" Albert Einstein

[Anonymous 11]

My cousin is married to a Radiologist. He and I have had discussions on this very topic. He agrees with me. I’m not talking low end script monkey type IT work. I’m very pragmatic too.

A typical enterprise IT setup is very complicated and there are many unknowns. Using diagnostics, logic, experience, and intuition, I will find the actual problem. Many people will confuse symptoms with the root problem. I used to try to tutor junior guys into looking past the symptoms. Sometimes symptoms indicate the problem and sometimes they are secondary to the problem.

Blood = packets. Nerves = fiber optics, Ethernet cables, routers, and switches. Being a good diagnostician is critical to success in IT even programming. I use the scientific method quite often in IT as my STEM degree is in a hard physical science. I’ve worked with a lot of IT guys not trained in the scientific method as it’s not part of the IT curriculum. I find it highly valuable, and it has given me an edge over the years. My solutions also cannot destroy the system either. I can’t stand watching IT guys do random troubleshooting.

Hard core IT troubleshooting is very analogous to medicine minus the gore. My vet was explaining to me today how they cannot always identify the exact cause of an animal’s illness. I told him I perfectly understood his problem more so than many others.

We then went on to mutually rage about women who tend cat colonies. He told me the cats are decimating the song bird population. I’m calling animal control about our crazy cat lady. My neighborhood is crawling with feral cats.

Stargazer wrote:

own arrogance, lack of social skill and p~~~ poor business acumen.

So true. Some of the most intelligent people I’ve ever met are arrogant and have zero social skills. I’m supposedly highly intelligent according to the tests. I have great social skills and recognize that I really know nothing in the grand scheme of things.

Killmandrill wrote:

manual skills are always a good thing to have, be it repairing cars,

I’m a decent car mechanic too. I know a lot of scientists and engineers who are very good car mechanics.

[KillmandrillParticipant 497]

Anonymous wrote:

I’m a decent car mechanic too. I know a lot of scientists and engineers who are very good car mechanics.

Car mechanic was my first apprenticeship at a Toyota dealership, but I worked on lots of different brands meanwhile. Here you can learn a trade in 3 years (sometimes 3.5 yrs) vocational school and working at a shop. Finished my apprenticeship in 1988 as “Geselle” (journeyman?!), worked in all kinds of trades there after welding, steel construction, special equipment and so on, till I decided to learn another trade, bending over hoods of cars is not for big people.
Went for IT (software development) and finished the apprenticeship with a craft certificate in 2003.

Still work on classic cars in the family, it´s more fun to work on cars when time is not after you (work units). Cars have changed very much since 1988, I learned how to overhaul carburetors, repair alternators or starter motors, take engines and gearboxes apart, exchange parts and put them back together again and so on, all that is not done anymore it is only being replaced because it is too expensive to repair it.
My Dad infected me with cars, he´s a good mechanic too, and a scientist (physics). He used to race in SCCA (club races) in a TR3 (tuned to about 140 hp) back in the days.

Ah, women. They make the highs higher and the lows more frequent. Friedrich Nietzsche

[Wandering MGHOWParticipant 551]

I’m almost approaching the big 3-0 and I feel like a f~~~ing loser. I really want to learn a trade or IT but I have 0 experience with either and feel like I’m too old. Those 2 careers seem like they would be good for an introverted MGTOW like myself, not to mention good money. Any advice for me?

Should I get started or look elsewhere? Which one as better to get started with at my age – a trade (electrician) or IT?

[KillmandrillParticipant 497]

Wandering MGHOW wrote:

I’m almost approaching the big 3-0

I learned my second trade at the age of 34, so no it is never too late by age. There was a guy in my school that was 55. Don´t worry about your age just look forward to the goal of your efforts it will pay out in the long run.

Becoming an apprentice in Germany is quite is simple, look up companies hiring in the field you are interested in (job agencies, yellow pages, online platforms etc.) and write an application and see what happens.

I´m not quite sure where you are in the world, in the USA (i.e) that might be a different thing by how to approach/finance and the apprenticeship/training itself.

Ah, women. They make the highs higher and the lows more frequent. Friedrich Nietzsche

[Anonymous 3]

Rules wrote:

Automation is about to replace great number of jobs. Many people claim that the answer is higher education and more college degrees. However, a great number of so called higher skilled jobs are repetitive too and can be automated. High education may be a very bad investment.

If you want a higher educatio you:1) get a lot of debt,2) may lose a lot of friends because higher education takes a lot of time, 3)lose a lot of free time

Since the robots can also do the high skilled jobs, the skills needed in labor market will be interpersonal skills and social skills. These skills are conversely correlated to the amount you spend reading books. Young person doesnt develop these skills reading maths. Ironically, the so called “bad boys” who have done everything opposed what school told them may have chosen the right pathwayö.

College and high education are a bad investment. Skills needed in the future are interpersonal skills and physical attractiveness which affects your social skills very much.

And who’s going to programme all these robots and computers for Chad, while he’s socialising? Or will the machines work on fairy dust?

[Anonymous 3]

Eyeswideopen wrote:

I think smart people separate a job from their identity. A job is simply exchanging time for money. Work is not suppose to be fun – it is called work for a reason

I think the real issue is ‘work’. If you’re working, then you’re not really successful. If you look at the most successful people, they don’t ‘work’, as such.

Eyeswideopen wrote:

Getting a degree in ancient history demonstrates intellectual aptitude but is meaningless towards putting food on the table and a roof over your head. The debt alone from said degree will take decades to pay off at a minimum wage job.

Mmmmm….I’m not sure this is always good advice. I took career-relevant qualifications myself, so yes, that worked for me, but I think there’s something to be said for a good general education. I understand the point you are making, but I think you’re over-straining it. A degree in ancient history can lead to a STEM career, or a management trainee programme, or a career as a military pilot, or anything. It’s not a tiny little box only for people who want to work in museums.

I disagree with the general tenor of comments on here. It’s now de rigueur – practically cliché – to workship STEM degrees and assume they are more relevant, and harder or more rigorous, but that’s simply not true. I think liberal arts degrees are as relevant, useful and important as STEM degrees, and don’t in any case define somebody’s career.

I think the best advice regarding degrees and education is to study what you want to study, and do well at it. If people followed that simple, common-sense advice, it would solve a lot of problems. Be it something work or career-related, STEM or liberal arts, do what you want and do well at it. Normally that should lead to a desirable outcome. The only additional advice would be that liberal arts graduates should be flexible about their career and job choices initially.

[Jan SobieskiParticipant 28791]

Education is a boondoggle. A masters degree in feminists studies and 60K of debt, makes you qualified to do nothing.

Even a STEM degree isn’t a guarantee. I am a STEMer, but a blue collar STEMer. My future is not a slam dunk.

Be able to work with your hands, get dirt under your nails.

Love is just alimony waiting to happen. Visit mgtow.com.

[RulesParticipant 55]

Anonymous wrote:

Rules wrote:

Automation is about to replace great number of jobs. Many people claim that the answer is higher education and more college degrees. However, a great number of so called higher skilled jobs are repetitive too and can be automated. High education may be a very bad investment.

If you want a higher educatio you:1) get a lot of debt,2) may lose a lot of friends because higher education takes a lot of time, 3)lose a lot of free time

Since the robots can also do the high skilled jobs, the skills needed in labor market will be interpersonal skills and social skills. These skills are conversely correlated to the amount you spend reading books. Young person doesnt develop these skills reading maths. Ironically, the so called “bad boys” who have done everything opposed what school told them may have chosen the right pathwayö.

College and high education are a bad investment. Skills needed in the future are interpersonal skills and physical attractiveness which affects your social skills very much.

And who’s going to programme all these robots and computers for Chad, while he’s socialising? Or will the machines work on fairy dust?

A big portion of programming can be automated. When programming tools are getting more sophisticated, work that once needed a big number of people doing intellectual job, can be done withe less people who are doing simplier tasks. Productivity will also increase in the field of programming. Google:”white collars turn blue”. Especially if you are an average white collar guy, your job prospects might be much lesser than ypu think.

Since the machines can do both intellectual jobs and manual jobs, the area where people should develope their skills into are interpersonal skills and social interaction. Those skills cannot be done By machine. Ad those are skills that you dont develope learning science or maths.

High skills are greatly overrated.

[StargazerParticipant 12505]

Jan Sobieski wrote:

Education is a boondoggle. A masters degree in feminists studies and 60K of debt, makes you qualified to do nothing.

Apparently it qualifies people to attempt to put a man in the white house who says he will tax the people who ARE qualified to do something as much as it takes to pay off their student loan debt and force businesses to pay them $30K a year plus benefits to flip burgers for the rest of their lives.

If that’s what kids are learning in university, then they probably came out dumber than when they went in.

[Anonymous 11]

Automation and AI are going to cut like a scythe across all fields of work from medicine, engineering, science, law, truck drivers and fast food workers. No one will be exempt from its impact.

Given the trend of concentration of wealth to the oligarchs over the past 35 years. I don’t see this ending well. A critical failure will occur when there are enough jobless, that the entire house of cards will just collapse. The oligarchy simply does not have enough people in it to sustain a functioning economy. I know the workers on Pedophile Island will be fine though.

[Anonymous 3]

Rules wrote:

<
When programming tools are getting more sophisticated, work that once needed a big number of people doing intellectual job, can be done withe less people who are doing simplier tasks. Productivity will also increase in the field of programming.

But this has always been the case, both before and after the invention of microcomputers. There has always been a move towards greater efficiency. What you’re saying is nothing new.

There have been scare stories along these lines since the advent of industrialisation. It’s what gave rise to the Luddite movement in industrial England during the 19th. century.

It’s forgotten now, but during the 1960s there were scare stories everywhere in the West about the impact that technology and automation would have on ordinary jobs. Just like today, back then there were people like you who wrote things like: “Nobody will have a job in five years. The system will collapse.”

But it didn’t.

Don’t misunderstand – I’m not saying you’re technically wrong in what you say. Automation has displaced jobs and will continue to do so. To that extent, you’re right. Technology always displaces jobs because when it’s efficient and profitable to invest, capitalists and business owners will do so in priority to employing people. But that won’t stop people being employed elsewhere in other fields or as programmers or as managers, etc.

My specific point in relation to your post is that if Chad can’t program the robots, machines and computers, then he’ll be vulnerable unless he can perform in a managerial or sales role. It’s always been true – again, what you say is nothing new – that people with managerial/sales skills will tend to become business owners, but there will also be a need for people with technical skills. That won’t stop just because computers have greater processing power or artificial intelligence advances and develops. If anything, this progress should lead to more technical jobs, including jobs you and I can’t even imagine.

[RulesParticipant 55]

finnish it-expert Hyppönen(in finnish language:http://yle.fi/uutiset/hurja_ennuste_f-securen_hypposelta_tekoaly_tekee_ohjelmoijista_tyottomia/9013309):
“AI will replace all programmers within few decades”

High skills are becoming redunant. It will all be social skills. College is WASTE OF MONEY!!!!

[Author]

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