Home › Forums › Marriage & Divorce › Do Prenups Work?
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Voidraithe 4 years, 9 months ago.
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I’m curious to hear from people who’ve been divorced… do prenups work in Canada? I hear they don’t always work in the US but I could never figure out what the circumstances were…
The effectiveness of the prenup depends on its language. Personally, I am unaware of canadian law on the matter. I would consider this; if a prenup is designed to insure the protection of your assets…..why sign anything in the first place? If you would like to go through the process of marriage I can understand. Yet, you can have the ceromony without signing the documentation. None of it promotes a balanced and equal relationship on any level. If the is mutual acknowledgement of the need of a prenup then I would simply not sign anything from jump. She is no less protected with no contract at all than she is with a prenup.
I am no law expert but I have done some research on prenups in the US. They’re only marginally useful. The main things you can use them to protect is assets you’ve acquired prior to the marriage and some future assets like inheritances. Most states look down upon or outright outlaw clauses that cover alimony. You cannot have any clauses about child custody either. There’s some things you need to do to make your prenup more solid, like having it signed way in advance of your marriage.
If for any reason the judge determines that your prenup is “unfair” they will toss it out and go on their marry way divorce raping you. Prenups usually get thrown if the couple has children, or if the woman sheds a tear for the judge. Having a prenup against your wife is essentially a bluff that she’ll not win in divorce court.
[url url=http://www.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/2d6337/i_was_divorce_raped_dont_be_me] I'm paying her 25% of my salary over the next eight years. I had to pay my lawyer, her lawyer, 50% of all my retirement funds and give her another few thousand dollars to make her go away. It cost me $20 to get married and will cost me over $220,000 to get divorced. [/url]
So basically, the prenup is just a piece of fancy paper that doesn’t do a whole lot. Is there nothing to protect my assets from a divorce that’s not my fault???
I am completely unfamiliar with Canadian law but I think I’ve heard someone speak of creating a trust to funnel all your assets to. Then I guess everything technically belongs to the trust. It sounds reasonable on the surface but I don’t know how or if it would actually work. I’m no lawyer.
I think we have a few members here that are actuallyattorneys. Perhaps they can chime in on the subject?
HISTORY...learn from it, memorize it, DON'T repeat it...I’m curious to hear from people who’ve been divorced… do prenups work in Canada? I hear they don’t always work in the US but I could never figure out what the circumstances were…
Only if the judge says they do. More often than not they get tossed out entirely in the face of a crying woman. I’ve heard of judges taking the legal opinion that signing on the marriage contract voids the pre-nup contract. The courts in general consider the three party marriage contract between you, her, and the state to supersede your two party pre-nup contract that’s just between you and her. This despite the fact that the state, through the courts, can arbitrarily change the terms of your marriage contract on a whim. usually the best you can hope from a pre-nup is it will intimidate her into not completely raping you during arbitration before it goes before a judge, because, again, the judge is empowered to throw it out entirely. And if there are any children, even if they’re only her children by a previous man, you have no chance at all. Sacrifice a goat and say some hail marys because that’s your only option.
It’s possible you might try something like a pre-cohabitation contract, which would have more weight than a pre-nup, but only because you are not locking yourself into a marriage contract. Even then I don’t know how it would stand up to all that common law marriage bulls~~~. But rest assured, once you sign on the bottom line you are completely at the mercy of others, paperwork or no.
Really it’s best to avoid it altogether. Don’t get married. It’s not like there’s any benefit for you in it anyways.
I am completely unfamiliar with Canadian law but I think I’ve heard someone speak of creating a trust to funnel all your assets to. Then I guess everything technically belongs to the trust. It sounds reasonable on the surface but I don’t know how or if it would actually work. I’m no lawyer.
Judges can bust trusts. And do.
Your only guaranteed course of action is to just say no to marriage.
I’m not a lawyer but I am a Canadian who has been through the wringer. The judge can chuck anything he doesn’t want to abide by. The first thing he’ll say is the Pre Nuptial contravenes the Family Relations Act. Here is the overriding principle. The Judges first priority is to protect the children first. If they are very young he’ll make sure that custody goes to the most qualified which is usually the mother. The matrimonial home will be divided equally, but the judge will give occupancy to the person who has primary custody of the children because they need a home. The husband will retain his half. But the judge will still make the husband pay the mortgage and give the husband the ability to recover half the payments paid when the home is sold. The children do not have the right to give up their claim to support from both parents. If the mother has primary custody, she will be given the opportunity to be a stay-at-home mother and the husband will be charged both Child Support Payments and Alimony, so she has some money to cover her half of the support requirements for the kids. Now Canadian Law is catching up with places like California. The husband will also have to give up half of any Canada Pension Plan, Registered RRSP’s, Tax Free Savings Accounts, and the such. What is really bad is if there is a Family Trust in which you are just one of several beneficiaries (like your brothers and sisters are the other beneficiaries). Your ex-wife can actually claim the whole thing, not just your part.
After saying all of this, it is far better to have a Pre Nuptial Agreement than the Marriage Contract (Marriage Licence). It would at least spell out what was intended when you got married with respect to assets obtained prior to the marriage. A Pre Nuptial should also cover things like Family Trusts, Alter Ego Trusts, etc. But like I said, kids change the picture. What I have done: I have never remarried. I screw anything I can. I have my own home, I commute to my “companions” home every day to see my son, get laid, etc. We do not Co-habitate. I do not have the same mailing address. I do not live with my “companion”. I can’t be held responsible for anything. Infidelity is no problem. Works for me, and I go home by myself to my own refuge most nights.
That is unequal, unfair, and unjust… if I were the parent, I’d happily take the kids and work at the same time. I don’t need her money or resources. This is just pure exploitation so she doesn’t have to work for the next 20-30 years yet be able to afford to live a hedonistic lifestyle off of someone else’s hard work. What happened to society?!
What happened to society?
That is the number one question that has been asked for the past 20 years. Hell, books have even been written on the subject.
But if you ask me, nothing has been done to improve it. And society has only gotten worse.
Nothing really tends to surprise me anymore, not even the next outrageous horror story that tends to come up in these forums. I guess all we can do is roll with the punches. “Damn the torpedoes. Full speed ahead!” Life and society is full of risks that way.
Prenups used to work. Now your best case scenario of having at least a 50 percent chance of a prenup being held up in court is to have the whole damn prenup signed while VIDEOTAPING it, and with lawyers present. But good luck getting a woman to go along with just the MENTION of a prenup, without the mention of videotaping and lawyers.
They claim that marriage shouldn’t be about prenups, but about ROMANCE. Not lawyers and documents being signed. No, all that should be reserved for a DIVORCE, right?
Unless they’re the ones who feel like they have money and assets to protect. As long as a prenup would protect whatever s~~~ a woman happens to own, women wouldn’t mind bringing up prenups. The ones that object because it’s “unromantic” are the ones who don’t own S~~~ and who are looking to get married just so they can get some fancy s~~~ to own out of it.
Vs. prenups, maybe look into “trusts,” pricey but a fortress, I don’t know. Someone here must.
"It seems like there's times a body gets struck down so low, there ain't a power on earth that can ever bring him up again. Seems like something inside dies so he don't even want to get up again. But he does."
Anonymous42They claim that marriage shouldn’t be about prenups, but about ROMANCE.
F~~~ prenuptial thinking! Marriage is with the state! Governed by laws! The state grants women all the power they need to destroy a man, and then supplies the woman with food and shelter to comfort her during HER storm! Who the f~~~ in there right mind would want to get married? Oh yea, WOMEN!
oopsie,
if you click on my title, and read through my posts, you’ll find one where I describe the experience I had with a prenup, and with friends and relatives who had prenups. The short version of it is that her lawyer’s first argument will be to have her legal fees come from the ‘family’s assets’ until it can be ascertained for certain that the prenup is valid. Your lawyer will lose that argument, and will not actually make any great effort to win it…because if she has no money to fight it, then the divorce, and your attorney’s billable hours will end quickly. Your attorney has no interest in a quick win that earns him little money. A long slow fight is much more profitable, regardless of outcome. If judges are elected where you live, you can assume that both lawyers will have contributed to his last election. The judge knows what his contributors expect (a long slow profitable fight). Think carefully about this before you get into any kind of legal proceeding.I had a ring side seat for the divorce of a relative who was a CEO of his company. He had a six figure salary, a seven figure net worth, and a prenup. After his attorney lost the point about her legal fees, her lawyer and his lawyer both had access to his money. They ran up $220,000 in legal expenses over the next 2 years arguing over wether the prenup was valid. She got ‘temporary spousal support’ while they argued because even though the prenup prohibited temporary spousal support, it took 2 years to determine that it was actually valid…
You want to protect your assets? NEVER let anyone know you have them. NEVER allow yourself into a position where anyone has any reason to feel entitled to them.
You want to keep ants out of the sugar in your pantry? Put it in an air tight container so that they cannot see, touch, or smell it! Because once they are aware of it, you’ll never be rid of your ant problem.
Same principle. Same reasoning.
Marriage is broken and is now toxic to you. Do not try to pick that s~~~ up and try to fix it. It’s bigger than you. You cannot fix it. You will not be the exception, and it will ultimately poison you if you try.
The divorce industry requires the assets of men to survive (since women don’t bring any). Your lawyer is not your friend. The judge is not impartial, and the industry is not going to voluntarily starve itself so that you can walk away with a fair settlement.
This is as clear as I can make it for you. If you are still foolish enough to allow your assets onto the radar of this industry, then you are soon to prove once again the old line about a fool and his money being soon to part …
Look, it's not my fault that tornado dropped a house on your sister. Now get back on your broom and get your ass out of here... and take your monkeys with you
Pre-nups help. If you are not comfortable enough with your woman to bring them up, and she is not good enough to sign one, then you have saved yourself the huge expense of divorce.
But, trust the rest of the men here when they tell you marriage is always and everywhere a bad idea. In Canada I think you are even more screwed than in the U.S. You can only live with a woman for some time, and you become her husband automatically.
Tell your woman you find it too unromantic to sign marriage documents.
Anything in a court of law involving lawyers is susceptible to being twisted in the other party’s favor. I wouldn’t trust them, at least not completely.
The Children of Doom... Doom's Children. They told my lord the way to the Mountain of Power. They told him to throw down his sword and return to the Earth... Ha! Time enough for the Earth in the grave.JFC! My best friend(and boss at my bouncing gig) recently proposed to his gf. I flipped my s~~~ and I went off on him like I never have before. He is a business owner(and full-fledged mangina). He says he’s gotten her to agree to a prenup and I repeated over and over that signing a marriage contract can and probably will void the prenup.
This bitch has three kids from two donors and never been married.<–no more needs to be said.
Judges overturn prenuptial agreements all the time. Don’t trade your freedom for a piece of paper.
Society asks MGTOWs: Why are you not making more tax-slaves?
Asking ” Do Prenups Work?” is like asking ” Do marriages work?” A lot of them fail. Do you want to take a chance?Do you feel lucky?How lucky do you feel?
How does the idea of a 44 Magnum divorce sound to you?
Being “in love” ,having orgasms with a woman – do you know what this does to your brain ? How it can impair your thinking ?
The answer is no and yes.
No they dont always work.
I think you are asking the wrong question.
I think the question is How much are you willing to risk?
One more thing guys any woman at any time can say “he da daddy” and you have a limited amount of time to get a DNA test to avoid 18 to 25 years of court ordered child support obligations.
^ some humor
These are real life (paternity fraud)
http://reason.com/blog/2015/02/19/judge-outraged-at-innocent-man-orders-hi
http://womenformen.org/2015/01/27/detroit-man-ordered-to-pay-for-child-whos-not-his/
http://www.avoiceformen.com/mens-rights/paternity-fraud-father-by-default/
frankly my dear i don't give a damn
Prenuptial Agreements in Canada
Jeremy D. Morley
Prenuptial agreements are generally enforceable in Canada. Courts in Ontario and other common law provinces of Canada previously considered marriage contracts to be contrary to public policy and unenforceable, but the 1978 Family Law Reform Act (now continued in the Family Law Act) in Ontario and similar legislation in other provinces specifically authorizes them.Prenuptial Agreements in Ontario: The Family Law Act of Ontario authorizes marital contracts between two people who are married or intend to be married to each other. The agreements must be in writing, signed by the parties and witnessed. They may deal with a broad range of matters, including the ownership or division of property, support obligations, matters concerning the education and “moral training” of children (but not issues concerning custody of or access to children) and “any other matter.”
The legislation precludes spouses from opting out of those provisions in the Act that protect the rights of each of spouses to the matrimonial home.
The Act provides that a court may set aside a provision for support or a waiver of the right to support in a marriage contract and may determine and order support even though the contract contains an express provision excluding the application of this section:
- If the provision for support or the waiver of the right to support results in unconscionable circumstances;
- If the provision for support is in favor of, or the waiver is by or on behalf of, a dependent who qualifies for allowance for support out of public money; or
- If there is default in the payment of support under the contract or agreement at the time the application is made.
As a result, a provision in the marriage contract either limiting or precluding a claim for future support is very much subject to the discretion of the court at the time an application for support is made.
The Act allows a court to set aside a marriage contract, either in whole or in part, if:
- A party failed to disclose significant assets, debts or other liabilities;
- A party did not understand the nature or consequences of the contract; or
- The law of contract so requires, meaning that the enforcement of the agreement is barred by duress, undue influence, fraud, fundamental breach or unconscionability.
The Ontario legislation does not expressly require that a party must receive independent legal advice but the failure to receive such advice is a clear “red flag.”
Prenuptial Agreements in British Columbia<span style=”font-weight: bold;”>: </span> The Family Relations Act of British Columbia recognizes the validity of marriage agreements but authorizes allow the court to set aside or vary them if they are found to be unfair in all of the circumstances.
The Act requires that such agreements must be in writing, signed by both spouses, and witnessed by one or more other persons.
Specifically, Sec. 65(1) of the Family Relations Act, R.S.B.C. 1996, c. 128, provides that upon a divorce the court may divide the marital property as it deems fit “f the provisions for division of property…would be unfair having regard to (a) the duration of the marriage, (b) the duration of the period during which the spouses have lived separate and apart, (c) the date when property was acquired or disposed of, (d) the extent to which property was acquired by one spouse through inheritance or gift, (e) the needs of each spouse to become or remain economically independent and self-sufficient, or (f) any other circumstances relating to the acquisition, preservation, maintenance, improvement or use of property or the capacity or liabilities of a spouse.”
In Dowell v. Dowell, 2008 BCSC 138, the British Columbia Supreme Court reviewed a marriage agreement that had been entered into between two retired people who then shared a long marriage. The Agreement provided that each party would retain their pre-marriage assets. The Court expressed concern that the agreement did not contain any provision for support and that the wife had not obtained independent legal advice. It varied the agreement by awarding 22% of the family assets to the wife and the balance to the husband.
I found this at http://www.internationalprenuptials.com/prenups-in-canada.html
Basically looks like they will be honored unless deemed “unfair”. In order to make the prenup fair looks like you need to have independent legal consultation in other words, pay a bunch of lawyers a bunch of money.
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