The thought of ‘going my own way’ in the sense of being alone (which is what it will mean in my case) depresses me, but it also excites me in that it means, if I want to, I can start my life now, a life of danger and adventure, knowing that I will never have the shackles and burdens that Blue Pillers have.  Everything comes at a price, but is MGTOW worth the price of lifelong loneliness and lack of female companionship?  I’ve always wanted children, to have a family around me and give happiness to others.

So I don’t know – this isn’t easy, but I think I’m moving towards a fully-fledged MGTOW position and leaving the vestigial Blue Pill desires and aspirations aside, as powerful as they are.  I’ve always been that way implicitly anyway, not out of any positive choice but due to my crippling shyness and lack of confidence.  The difference is that it may now become a choice as I give up on women for good.

YOU ARE A UTILITY

I guess what I’m saying, don’t lie to yourself and say you’re alone because of MGTOW.  No, you’re alone because of your shyness, etc.  If you aren’t comfortable with that, then work on fixing it.  And honestly, getting a GF or wife won’t make you feel less lonely.   You could actually end up trapped feeling lonely, and yet not allowed to be alone with your own thoughts.

..women probably pick this up from me

i’ve also been thinking lately about my body language and how i appear in public places and what signals i’m sending ..such as shopping
i’m not saying the way i act at a grocery store has anything to do directly with gmow, but especially in the last year or so, i do tend to naturally ignore
i guess it’s just they way i’ve become after twenty years of not caring what they think and whether they’re there or not
and maybe they sense something ..i just quietly and methodically tend to my business in a relaxed way and rarely make eye contact with female shoppers
i’m certainly not rude, and when i check-out i do speak briefly to the clerk
but as i go about my shopping, i would assume most guys look around at the gals much more than i do
as far as how i’m dressed, it’s just casual stuff, i’m certain in that regards i appear similar to most other guys in the store
..women do not approach me and start up conversation, so my distant behavior does not seem to be attracting anyone ..yet, they don’t
move away from me either, if i’m looking over the cheese selection in the center aisle cooler, there might be a youngish lady standing right next to me with her cart. she doesn’t move away so i know i’m not scaring her with my indifferent attitude; my ignoring her. i might pass her again in another aisle or two ..so maybe they are occasionally curious about this guy who treats them like wall flowers, or maybe, most likely it’s just coincidence ..i’ll never know and i don’t really care 🙂

hmskl’d wrote:

..so maybe they are occasionally curious about this guy who treats them like wall flowers, or maybe, most likely it’s just coincidence ..i’ll never know

Thinking and imagining scenarios is fun in its own way…

narwhal wrote:

Victor, I don’t think you’re looking at this in the best way. If you are not happy with your life because you’re alone, then you should look to change your behavior so that you aren’t alone. That doesn’t mean that you need to throw more energy into dating sites, it means maybe make more/better friendships. That most likely means friendships with other men.

That might not work as I am not really ‘attracted’ to men in the social sense in the way that most other men are.  Men tend to like hanging around with other men.  I’m one of the exceptions, in that I don’t.  I’m just being honest here – I find most (but not all – I don’t want to generalise too harshly) men to be boorish, arrogant, conceited, stupid, and – worst of all – dull.  Not to put a downer on men exclusively – I have a fair few things to say about women too, and being a man myself, I probably exhibit a lot of those qualities and attributes from time-to-time.  It’s just the way I feel about it – I’m an equal opportunities misanthrope.  I hate/dislike all (most) people.

I’ve got my own pet theory about this, specifically that I think the vast majority of heterosexual men have a latent sexual attraction to other men and this is ‘normal’ in the evolutionary sense.  Women pick this up as a signal of a man’s suitability, in that he is accepted by the group and is willing to conform with groupthink and values.  It’s a pre-programmed, instinctual thing.

A minority of heterosexual men, such as myself – we’re maybe 5% of the male population – can’t relate to other men in most situations and women sense this, which makes it harder (though not impossible) for us to form relationships with the opposite sex.  This is probably mostly due to a bad home and school environment, which moulds the personality in a certain way, combined perhaps with some genetic factors which express themselves negatively under said environmental conditions.

In a way, all this could be reduced to a more simple, common-sensical observation – the harder you find it to relate to other men, the harder it will be to relate to women too as they will observe your difficulties and be turned off by it.  If you like, you might say I’m an ‘extreme heterosexual’ – I have little or no interest in men at all, I am only interested in women.  In fact, if I was a woman (which I don’t want to be, just saying for argument’s sake), I’d probably be a lesbian – i.e. still only be attracted to other women.

Does that make any sense?  Probably not, but then real people are multi-layered and complex and often contradictory.  I’m not an effeminate man.  I have a typical male physique, some female-type interests (reading classic novels, writing, music, art) but also a lot of male-type interests (martial arts, boxing, computers, hiking, collecting stuff) and I have a general male-type outlook (my politcal views are far-Right, among other things).

narwhal wrote:

Maybe that means you have some sort of relationship with a women as friends, or something a little more.

Not interested, though the few times when I can say I have enjoyed a social conversation, it has been with a woman.  The stereotype is largely true – women are best at intimate conversations.  I want some more of that, but this time a romantic relationship.  I have never been ‘friends’ with a woman and don’t want to start now.  If friendship is all women have to offer me, they can stick it.

narwhal wrote:

Use what you know about MGTOW to keep you from making mistakes, like thinking paying for dinner is going to be appreciated for example. I guess what I’m saying, don’t lie to yourself and say you’re alone because of MGTOW. No, you’re alone because of your shyness, etc. If you aren’t comfortable with that, then work on fixing it. And honestly, getting a GF or wife won’t make you feel less lonely. You could actually end up trapped feeling lonely, and yet not allowed to be alone with your own thoughts.

Yes, good advice and this is all true.  Like others here, I am benefiting from this site.  I suppose I’ve always been a MGTOW-type person, but even for me, this site is a real education and the comments on here, yours and others, are excellent.  Thanks all.