I would argue that a lot of life is personal preferences.  A lot of arguing is over should or shouldn’t do.  What I would say about MGTOW is you see this as a reality, and accept your preferences as acceptable, and realize others may like other things different.  With this, there really isn’t a way to argue or reason why you like something, just look at if it benefits you.

So, in short, MGTOW can mean you no longer have to justify to the world what you like or don’t like.  You CAN look if it is beneficial to you or not, and someone can point out negative health effects to you of something.  There is also the possible harm doing something can do to others, in regards to actually harming them, not offending their sensibilities.  And I believe a MGTOW can accept that others may shun him because he doesn’t meet his preferences.

But, how the heck would one argue that a personal preference is superior to another one?  I just don’t see how that would work.

But, how the heck would one argue that a personal preference is superior to another one? I just don’t see how that would work.

I would say that there are two ways to look at the issue: Proselytize, or don’t proselytize.

1) Should you proselytize and take your message out to society? If you proselytize, problems arise: You collide with alternate opinions and world views and get into ideological battles. Zealots overdo the message. You have to consider how you appear to the world and censor your own people to make your message appealing (putting lipstick on a pig). And so on.

2) If you don’t proselytize, people with other viewpoints see you doing your own thing and criticize. But it’s easier to take a defensive posture and assert one’s own opinion against critics than it is to proselytize and try to change the opinions of others. That was the subject of this thread: http://www.mgtow.com/forums/topic/how-can-i-feel-somewhat-prejudice-towards-females-without-feeling-guilty/

As I said there:

Just make a strong statement of where you’re coming from and what you want to achieve in the world. If women or feminists aren’t helping you get there, then the hell with them. They’re just shaming you and using you to get what *they* want.

It’s possible to make a strong defense of selfishness as a rational course of action. A couple examples come to mind:

–In the book “How To Fail at Everything and Still Win Big,” Scott Adams (creator of Dilbert) sings the praises of selfishness and indulging your dreams even at the risk of bankruptcy, divorce, not having a social life, etc. He says you can be generous and charitable after you’ve become a success.

–Similarly, Jeffrey Gitomer (“Little Red Book of Selling”) says that to get ahead as a salesman, one needs to create a supportive environment: “The right home and work environment will encourage you. Supportive spouse, family members, and co-workers will make the road to success a smooth ride. How conducive is your environment to attitude and success?” He is saying to be selfish and create an environment that will assist you and not distract you while you work. No one can fault you for that.

As long as you’re not proselytizing, then the burden’s on the other party to prove you wrong.

Anyway, here is my final answer:

I would say: Don’t proselytize. Feminists proselytize, and it’s easy to point out how they trash the places where they go: Political correctness, demonizing men, censorship.

MGTOW’s message is even less society-friendly than feminism: It’s “F~~~ society.” And it’s a bunch of p~~~ed-off men calling women “c~~~s, t~~~s, and sluts.” No way to make that image pretty. No way to put lipstick on that pig. And presumably we don’t want to start censoring posts to pretty up MGTOW’s image.

So instead of proselytizing, just make safe spaces (websites) where men can talk freely about how they’re sick of society without having to apologize for what they say. And if critics don’t like it, they can go f~~~ themselves: We weren’t talking to them in the first place. That gives us maximum freedom to say what we want, and minimum liability with regard to people who don’t like it.

And once you have that, what do you do next? (In another thread, you ask where MGTOW should go next.) IOW, what can MGTOW do for the MGTOWs themselves (as opposed to society as a whole)?

As I pointed out above, one justification for being selfish is so that you can focus on being successful. So maybe MGTOW can do some self-help or mutual support stuff. People come to message boards to ask for advice. MGTOW.com helps with that; some of the best threads are stickied. Just having a space where loners can talk among themselves is a great help.

Maybe some of the best individual posts could be highlighted in a self-help section. How do loners make their way in the world? What resources do they have? What’s an appropriate loner philosophy? Something like that. Mutual support without proselytizing.

Your mileage may vary. I’m just brainstorming here. I’m a noob, so I’m still sorting this stuff out myself.

When the radar goes up that you’re back in “that situation room conversation,” answer only with questions. Be polite, thoughtful, considerate, but only answer in questions. If you must, ask questions regarding their personal decisions, how much research they based them upon, why they may not have an up to date – objective outlook , their real reasons for  asking these questions. …  These types of conversations are seemingly driven by estrogen, something of which men are in short supply.  But if you sense they’re being conducted by testosterone ie someone hammering out a pecking order, then: in the words of Willard, “tear ’em up.”    : )

I would like to keep it this way. Growth as a man whether one likes it or not always comes from within. Taking away the effects of others ownerships on my ‘inner self’ real-estate frees up time and resources. When I find the need to justify my preference to the world, it would only be in effect to convince myself. Which is a bad sign. May be signing up to this website and expressing my views is sort of justifying going my way to the world. But I believe its the inception of the idea that needs taking a stronghold, then we can build on that. Like some members here who have been going their own way before the internet days.

That’s what happens when you brainstorm.

Anyway, maybe that previous post belongs more in the nearby “Out of the Plantation” thread.

I’m re-reading my previous post, and I’m realizing it kind of spun out of control. By the end, it was more about how the MGTOW group justifies its existence, rather than how the individual justifies his life choices to others. That’s what happens when you brainstorm. Anyway, maybe that previous post belongs more in the nearby “Out of the Plantation” thread.

It can be taken several different ways, whatever works.  I was seeing it more on a personal level.  Feel free to jump into the other post.

But they will when they see you enjoying the fruits of your labor.